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> Adieu -- No Joy With R198, Chucking pdaXrom; too frustrated
dlj0
post May 16 2007, 10:23 AM
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I first want to say that I appreciate all the work you guys did in creating pdaXrom. I installed beta1 last year when I got my 3100, and, although there were a few problems and limitations, it has been very useful.

I was hoping that going to the latest beta r198 would be an improvement. I had been afraid to try to upgrade, since the new uBoot and 2.6 kernels seemed to be causing some difficulties, but decided it was time to take the plunge. Actually, I had been waiting for a long time for the next stable release.... Well, this resulted in 24 solid hours of nightmarish problems.

OK, things aren't really set up to go from beta1 to the new version. Why not? That is gripe #1. I can understand not supporting people coming from oz or cacko, but... In following the "quick install" instructions to install uBoot, doing a low-level flash, I semi-permanently bricked my Zaurus. It took hours of trying the various Vulcan death grip boot sequences to get it to, one time, boot to the nand image. Why? I have no idea. I then managed, thanks to www.trisoft.de to restore the original Sharp rom, so I could start over. I re-loaded the uboot package, and found that OK+plugin would only boot the emergency image occasionally. Usually the thing would just sit there, emulating a brick again.

I then put a new image on the CF card, and managed to OK-start it eventually, and never, ever, got the question about whether I wanted to install. Went back to Sharp rom, re-formatted the hard drive, tried again, same deal. df indicated that /dev/hda1 was mounted on /mnt/cf, but it was the wrong size and unmount would not believe that it was mounted. So, I mounted /dev/hdc1 (the cf card) on /mnt/card, went there, and tried to run the ./autoboot.sh script. Never ran. I looked at it, and it was pretty simple, so entered the lines directly.

This is where I should mention that the link from the downloads page for the 3100 was to an akita image (and was so labelled). Anyway, it installed OK it seemed, and even booted. Claimed to be a borzoi, which was correct. But, df indicated only one partition, of size 128M. What happened to the hard drive? Well, duh, the script did exactly what it was supposed to do --- if I actually had a 1000. It installed the system on the flash. It ignored the existence of the hard drive.

Now, my hard drive was not a clean Sharp image. I had resized and reformatted the partitions when I installed beta1. But /dev/hda1 was formatted ext2, so it should have found that at least. Besides, from what the script says, it would install on the flash no matter what. Either remove 3000/3100/3200 from the link, or construct a new package that really can install on these machines. When the script says nandwrite /dev/mtd2 $file , it is probably going to write the image to the flash, not the hard drive.

At this point, I began casting about for a way to end my frustration. Unfortunately, I was unarmed, so instead of shooting something, I tried Angstrom.

From re-flash of the Sharp rom, re-format, etc., to a working system took maybe 45 minutes, and some of that was due to the fact that my hard drive was not formatted the way it was expected to be. But Angstrom keeps its mount instructions in /etc/fstab, so I could change the default vfat partition of /dev/hda3 (why??) to ext2. Next boot, no problem.

pdaXrom still has better feeds, which unfortunately don't run on Angstrom as far as I can determine. But the keyboard works (one thing that made me upgrade was that I decided to change the definition of one of the shortcut keys, and so of course lost the . -- which I used to know how to fix, but...), and the keys mean the same thing in all modes. Upgrade is trivial, just as it is in debian -- this is something that pdaXrom needs to fix. Angstrom is not quite as full-fledged-computer feeling as is pdaXrom, with everything running in fullscreen mode, but then, after all, it is a small screen.

Oh, well. Maybe someone else can tell me what stupid thing I did wrong. But it'll take a bit of convincing to get me to try this again.

Sorry to rant, but some of these things are things people should know about. Or, at least tall me where I went wrong.
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InSearchOf
post May 16 2007, 11:31 AM
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QUOTE(dlj0 @ May 16 2007, 02:23 PM)
I first want to say that I appreciate all the work you guys did in creating pdaXrom. I installed beta1 last year when I got my 3100, and, although there were a few problems and limitations, it has been very useful.

Thanks
QUOTE
I was hoping that going to the latest beta r198 would be an improvement.  I had been afraid to try to upgrade, since the new uBoot and 2.6 kernels seemed to be causing some difficulties, but decided it was time to take the plunge.  Actually, I had been waiting for a long time for the next stable release....  Well, this resulted in 24 solid hours of nightmarish problems.

The newest TEST release for pdaXrom is TEST...
QUOTE
OK, things aren't really set up to go from beta1 to the new version.  Why not?  That is gripe #1.  I can understand not supporting people coming from oz or cacko, but...  In following the "quick install" instructions to install uBoot, doing a low-level flash, I semi-permanently bricked my Zaurus.  It took hours of trying the various Vulcan death grip boot sequences to get it to, one time, boot to the nand image.  Why?  I have no idea.  I then managed, thanks to www.trisoft.de to restore the original Sharp rom, so I could start over.  I re-loaded the uboot package, and found that OK+plugin would only boot the emergency image occasionally.  Usually the thing would just sit there, emulating a brick again.


I think this is more of a understanding what is going on, I haven't had any problems installing uboot or booting into the emergancy console since about the first time I did it... removing all power sources assure the there no power flowing through the unit... holding the ok button while pluggin in the power is telling the device
"hey I'm powered up and the first key I sense is the "ok" button, that means I need to do this"

Once I understood this... I havent had a problem since... now you may say... why do you use uboot... why not just use the sharp bootloader or something less complicated... well that is a choice the dev team made and it will become useful in the near future...

QUOTE
I then put a new image on the CF card, and managed to OK-start it eventually, and never, ever, got the question about whether I wanted to install.  Went back to Sharp rom, re-formatted the hard drive, tried again, same deal.  df indicated that /dev/hda1 was mounted on /mnt/cf, but it was the wrong size and unmount would not believe that it was mounted.  So, I mounted /dev/hdc1 (the cf card) on /mnt/card, went there, and tried to run the ./autoboot.sh script.  Never ran.  I looked at it, and it was pretty simple, so entered the lines directly.


This is due to an issue with internal micro mounting as /mnt/cf/... we are working on updating the kernel and udev to work correctly with that... the issue us in /etc/fstab/ it is not set to mount automaticly at boot... if you set that... it will...
*Yes we should have announced this prior*

But this will all be resolved in the next release because he have include an installer for the OS.

QUOTE
This is where I should mention that the link from the downloads page for the 3100 was to an akita image (and was so labelled).  Anyway, it installed OK it seemed, and even booted.  Claimed to be a borzoi, which was correct.  But, df indicated only one partition, of size 128M.  What happened to the hard drive?  Well, duh, the script did exactly what it was supposed to do --- if I actually had a 1000.  It installed the system on the flash.  It ignored the existence of the hard drive.


Akita is how we label the series... the hardware in 1000, 3100,3200 is close enough for the images to be the same and the same for corgi builds 700, 750,760,860.

If you are referring to the installer going to the HD, that is where uboot comes into play. We will be developing for alternate boot mediums soon...

QUOTE
Now, my hard drive was not a clean Sharp image.  I had resized and reformatted the partitions when I installed beta1.  But /dev/hda1 was formatted ext2, so it should have found that at least.  Besides, from what the script says, it would install on the flash no matter what.  Either remove 3000/3100/3200 from the link, or construct a new package that really can install on these machines.  When the script says        nandwrite /dev/mtd2 $file , it is probably going to write the image to the flash, not the hard drive. 

I think the answer to this is above.. there was no intention to install to the HD

QUOTE
Oh, well.  Maybe someone else can tell me what stupid thing I did wrong.  But it'll take a bit of convincing to get me to try this again.

Sorry to rant, but some of these things are things people should know about.  Or, at least tall me where I went wrong.

I dont call this ranting... I call it detailed feedback... it is good to know what problems users run into and what we could do to better there experice using our distro... as noted by other pdaXrom current and ex-pdaxrom users it is pretty much built for people who already have a basic experience of linux... and that is true and we are working on making it universal... We will note all the griefs and suggestions and try to incorparate it into the builds to come...

Late

PS. I didnt proof read this... so if it makes no sense... sorry :-)
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HoloVector
post May 16 2007, 01:30 PM
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Nice reply, InSearchOf. smile.gif

Thanks for the detailed response. So there will be one installer for next release that will install both U-Boot and the release seamlessly? If so, that is great news.

Is it also possible to take a page from Meanie's pdaXii13 play book? In pdaXii13 Meanie put in an option to reset the MD partitioning to the factory setup since pdaXii13 on 3x00 needs a different partition scheme in order to install.

What I am looking for here, is an uninstall option in the new installer that erases U-Boot and reinstalls the old Sharp Boot Loader? I think that would get rid of alot of the U-boot criticisms since this allows the users to easily move back and forward between pdaXrom and the other ROMs. What do you think?
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InSearchOf
post May 16 2007, 04:27 PM
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QUOTE(HoloVector @ May 16 2007, 05:30 PM)
Nice reply, InSearchOf.  smile.gif
 

Thanks for the detailed response. So there will be one installer for next release that will install both U-Boot and the release seamlessly? If so, that is great news.


Ok... this should be feasible... for the c1000-up[ I can prolly get that to work... now
for 860-prior... that is a different story... I will have to work at that...

QUOTE
Is it also possible to take a page from Meanie's pdaXii13 play book?  In pdaXii13 Meanie put in an option to reset the MD partitioning to the factory setup since pdaXii13 on 3x00 needs a different partition scheme in order to install. 


Well as you know meanie is a pdaXrom dev... so anything is possible with the great mind he has :-)

QUOTE
What I am looking for here, is an uninstall option in the new installer that erases U-Boot and reinstalls the old Sharp Boot Loader?  I think that would get rid of alot of the U-boot criticisms since this allows the users to easily move back and forward between pdaXrom and the other ROMs.  What do you think?


That would be nice... but that might not be an easy task... I will defiently look at it though... but I will try to keep you upto date with what things we accomplish... what I would suggest is to put in a feature request under the pdaxrom tracker... so it is documented...

Late
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InSearchOf
post May 16 2007, 05:25 PM
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Thanks for adding that HoloVector... I may not get looked at in the next few days... but it will get touched...

Late
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HoloVector
post May 16 2007, 05:29 PM
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QUOTE(InSearchOf @ May 16 2007, 06:27 PM)
QUOTE(HoloVector @ May 16 2007, 05:30 PM)
Nice reply, InSearchOf.  smile.gif
 

Thanks for the detailed response. So there will be one installer for next release that will install both U-Boot and the release seamlessly? If so, that is great news.


Ok... this should be feasible... for the c1000-up[ I can prolly get that to work... now
for 860-prior... that is a different story... I will have to work at that...

QUOTE
Is it also possible to take a page from Meanie's pdaXii13 play book?  In pdaXii13 Meanie put in an option to reset the MD partitioning to the factory setup since pdaXii13 on 3x00 needs a different partition scheme in order to install. 


Well as you know meanie is a pdaXrom dev... so anything is possible with the great mind he has :-)

QUOTE
What I am looking for here, is an uninstall option in the new installer that erases U-Boot and reinstalls the old Sharp Boot Loader?  I think that would get rid of alot of the U-boot criticisms since this allows the users to easily move back and forward between pdaXrom and the other ROMs.  What do you think?


That would be nice... but that might not be an easy task... I will defiently look at it though... but I will try to keep you upto date with what things we accomplish... what I would suggest is to put in a feature request under the pdaxrom tracker... so it is documented...

Late
*


Thanks InSearchOf.

I created these as feature requests

Seamless U-Boot and pdaXrom installer - Case #200-35

Uninstall feature to remove U-Boot and reinstall the Sharp Boot Loader - Case #200-36

Drive partitioning through a pick list in the installer - Case #200-37

Thanks alot for listening cool.gif
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Chero
post May 17 2007, 01:06 AM
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Hi,

Since the question has been asked about uboot, I'll just tell here what I'm using it for right at this very moment. This is "experimental" and "not-completely-user-ready" right now, but it works.

I can dual-boot (or how to you call this when you have three options ?) my zaurus thanks to u-boot !
The beauty of u-boot is that it has some built-in features to boot from other media than the internal flash. To do this, you have to press (and hold) a key while rebooting the zaurus :
"OK" boots into the emergency system (as described a few times on the pdaX-site and the forums)
"1" boots from the first partition of an SD-card. (it has to be ext2 and there has to be a bootable system on it)
"2" boots from the first partition of my internal microdrive. (it has to be ext2 and there has to be a bootable system on it)
"3" boots from the first partition of a CF-card. (it has to be ext2 and there has to be a bootable system on it)
Note that "2" and "3" can be different depending on whether you have a CF-card inserted or not. I never have a CF-card in my zaurus as I use the slot for bluetooth, lan and wlan. This means that in my case I have to press "2" to boot from microdrive.

The guide-lines to create a bootable SD-image have been written by louigi600 on his page (http://www.seicento.selfip.org/ go to "documentation - creating SD image"). I changed the script a bit and did some manual work to create a bootable image on the internal microdrive as well.
(thanks a lot louigi600)
There are also guidelines over there to create your own u-boot, you don't need to do this to be able to dual-boot - you can do it with the u-boot that comes with r198.

Right now I have 3 setups : one on nand (default setup), one on SD (for compiling on board and testing) and one on microdrive (with xfce-bluetooth-samba-pims-gnumeric-portabase-... for use at work every day)
The benefits of having this are :
- I can easily test and mess up the installation on SD, if I really mess up I still can use my microdrive-boot for use at work (I NEED IT)
- the one on nand can be used for reference when writing docs and for reinstalling new releases
- the one on microdrive is the one I use for work in real life (it's on a 2Gb partition which means I don't have to worry about installing apps to "/" smile.gif ).

Since the devs are looking at EABI (see references in this very thread), I suppose in the future there will be a kernel that can be used for debian, angstrom and pdaXrom (this is not yet possible !!!). Can you imagine being able to boot pdaxrom, debian and angstrom without having to flash, reinstall or whatever ??

Maybe the devs wanted to keep this silent untill it works, then I'm sorry about lifting a tip of the velvet ... unsure.gif
I just wanted to tell people that u-boot isn't bad at all.

Have fun,
Chero.
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Capn_Fish
post May 17 2007, 03:49 AM
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You just copied the internal FS from flash to get it onto the microdrive? Or how did you do it? I'm interested...
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Chero
post May 17 2007, 05:48 AM
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QUOTE(Capn_Fish @ May 17 2007, 12:49 PM)
You just copied the internal FS from flash to get it onto the microdrive? Or how did you do it? I'm interested...
*


kind of ...
Check the script on louigi600's site i refer to in the previous post, it's quite readable and easy to adapt to copy to /mnt/ide instead of /mnt/card ...

Chero.
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