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> Opie/gpe, Some questions
Bundabrg
post Jun 28 2006, 10:45 PM
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Hi All,

(C860, 1Gb SD, Symbol24 Wifi CF)

OK, I'm doing a 'rom' tryout, and have now setup OZ Opie and GPE to run at the same time on VT2 and VT3. Also edited the relevant files so pressing <ctrl><alt>#num on any VT will change VT's fine. Oh, and switched / and ,.
The only thing I needed to do to really get this to work different from the wiki is to chmod u+s /usr/bin/chvt as chvt needs to run with root privs.
Oh, I also did it from the GPE image and then installing the Opie packages. The other way just seemed not to work well for me and indeed its interesting the number of differences the two ways gives (ie, /etc/ipkg/* versus /etc/ipkg.conf is one example).

Now I realise Opie/GPE is not a supported option, fair enough so I'm looking for what people who HAVE got it running did. Maybe some tricks and tips etc. I almost think that bar running qt4 under X instead, having a dual image would be useful, though installing it was fairly easy anyway.

My questions: -
- I've had to disabled ALL idle suspends etc under both GPE and Opie. Is there anyway that the idle checker can determine if there is activity on another VT? Currently if they are enabled, then if say I'm in GPE, and Opie suddenly realises there is no activty on it for 5 minutes, it suspends.

- Feeds. ipkg is really really REALLY slow. I think because of the base feed. However I can live with this. My issue is knowing if a package is opie or GPE when installing. Currently I comment out the opie feed, update then install when wanting to install a GPE app, and vice versa for opie. (IE, kopi is a good example). My question I guess is, are there any collisions of names between the feeds (the official OZ ones, not 3rd party).

- I have set my sd to be default install (after installing most OPIE and GPE apps to root first). However I have one of those annoying SD cards that comes up with Input/Output error frequently if under usage (even mounted sync). I solved this by forcing a sync every 1 second when installing packages and hopefully will get another card one day. When I restart, the SD card is never automatically checked, and I can't unmount it as its always in use now (applets running etc...). Any proper way of getting round this? I've updated the insert scripts so when an SD/CF is inserted, it runs a filesystem check on it, then plays a 'sound' when its done.



Oh and finally, why gpe-bootsplash? I always just remove this because I like to see whats happening. Why cover up nice the really nice main splash screen with the whiteout splash of GPE (though I now see that the boot messages come up through it, which is an improvement).

EDIT: Excuse typos. I've just had a daughter and am very sleep deprived (and hence why I have the time to reflash ;-)

- Bundabrg
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CoreDump
post Jun 29 2006, 01:13 AM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 29 2006, 08:45 AM)
Hi All,

(C860, 1Gb SD, Symbol24 Wifi CF)

OK, I'm doing a 'rom' tryout, and have now setup OZ Opie and GPE to run at the same time on VT2 and VT3. Also edited the relevant files so pressing <ctrl><alt>#num on any VT will change VT's fine. Oh, and switched / and ,.
The only thing I needed to do to really get this to work different from the wiki is to chmod u+s /usr/bin/chvt as chvt needs to run with root privs.
Oh, I also did it from the GPE image and then installing the Opie packages. The other way just seemed not to work well for me and indeed its interesting the number of differences the two ways gives (ie, /etc/ipkg/* versus /etc/ipkg.conf is one example).

Now I realise Opie/GPE is not a supported option, fair enough so I'm looking for what people who HAVE got it running did. Maybe some tricks and tips etc. I almost think that bar running qt4 under X instead, having a dual image would be useful, though installing it was fairly easy anyway.

My questions: -
  - I've had to disabled ALL idle suspends etc under both GPE and Opie. Is there anyway that the idle checker can determine if there is activity on another VT? Currently if they are enabled, then if say I'm in GPE, and Opie suddenly realises there is no activty on it for 5 minutes, it suspends.

  - Feeds. ipkg is really really REALLY slow. I think because of the base feed. However I can live with this. My issue is knowing if a package is opie or GPE when installing. Currently I comment out the opie feed, update then install when wanting to install a GPE app, and vice versa for opie. (IE, kopi is a good example). My question I guess is, are there any collisions of names between the feeds (the official OZ ones, not 3rd party).


No, with the possible exception of libsdl.

QUOTE
  - I have set my sd to be default install (after installing most OPIE and GPE apps to root first). However I have one of those annoying SD cards that comes up with Input/Output error frequently if under usage (even mounted sync). I solved this by forcing a sync every 1 second when installing packages and hopefully will get another card one day. When I restart, the SD card is never automatically checked, and I can't unmount it as its always in use now (applets running etc...). Any proper way of getting round this? I've updated the insert scripts so when an SD/CF is inserted, it runs a filesystem check on it, then plays a 'sound' when its done.


There is no such function in OZ currently. Patches which work with multi-partition cards are of course welcome smile.gif

QUOTE
Oh and finally, why gpe-bootsplash? I always just remove this because I like to see whats happening. Why cover up nice the really nice main splash screen with the whiteout splash of GPE (though I now see that the boot messages come up through it, which is an improvement).


Eye-candy. That's it, really. And the messages messing up the bootsplash on some models is a bug.
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Bundabrg
post Jun 29 2006, 01:44 AM
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Actually, interestingly if I disable gpe-bootsplash, Opie AND GPE execute on the same VT. So thats been re-enabled quicksmart.
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zedkatuf2
post Jun 29 2006, 10:07 PM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 29 2006, 07:45 AM)
Hi All,

(C860, 1Gb SD, Symbol24 Wifi CF)

Now I realise Opie/GPE is not a supported option, fair enough so I'm looking for what people who HAVE got it running did. Maybe some tricks and tips etc. I almost think that bar running qt4 under X instead, having a dual image would be useful, though installing it was fairly easy anyway.
*


FANTASTIC! Did the opie/gpe at same time info on the OZ wiki work then? When I tried on my ex-collie, when I tried running gpe, the X server would start & nothing else..actually, I might've got as far as the login screen, but when I tried logging in, gpe crashed & restarted...back to the login screen again ad nauseum sad.gif

If you have any insights let me know!
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Bundabrg
post Jun 29 2006, 11:56 PM
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The wiki is a bit out of date. As it stands now, GPE and OPIE start on different VT's, so you don't need to edit ANYTHING. Just add the feed, and do the install of the packages (with -force-overwrite for the bluetooth thing)

I may either update it (if I can get the access to that page) or do a writeup here if anyone is interested, though the wiki is pretty close. Maybe I'll make an 'ipk' with the correct dependencies and 'fixup' scripts.

The only showstopper-bug I've noticed (coming from pdaXrom though) is that my SD card is really pissing me off. Can't copy a 100Mb file to it (debian) as it gets halfway and hangs the whole system. That only happened under extreme load on pdaX but it still happened so I think I must have a dud SD sad.gif. Also, pdaX running X is vastly faster than GPE X, though I prefer the security design etc of GPE and its fullscreen wm etc...

Oh, and I've ended up editing xmodmaps so I can map the silkscreen keys in GPE. Is there a way to map them in Opie? (Ideally, I want to set the E/J key to toggle between opie/gpe).

For xmodmap, I edited /etc/X11/xmodmap.shepherd and added the following
CODE
! Silkscreen
keycode 118 = XF86Launch0
keycode 119 = XF86Launch1
keycode 120 = XF86Launch2
keycode 121 = XF86Launch3
keycode 122 = XF86Launch4


Then editing /etc/keylaunchrc to assign commands.

- Bundabrg

(Excuse my rambles.. still sleep deprived)
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zedkatuf2
post Jun 30 2006, 12:40 AM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 08:56 AM)
The wiki is a bit out of date. As it stands now, GPE and OPIE start on different VT's, so you don't need to edit ANYTHING. Just add the feed, and do the install of the packages (with -force-overwrite for the bluetooth thing)

I may either update it (if I can get the access to that page) or do a writeup here if anyone is interested, though the wiki is pretty close. Maybe I'll make an 'ipk' with the correct dependencies and 'fixup' scripts.

The only showstopper-bug I've noticed (coming from pdaXrom though) is that my SD card is really pissing me off. Can't copy a 100Mb file to it (debian) as it gets halfway and hangs the whole system. That only happened under extreme load on pdaX but it still happened so I think I must have a dud SD sad.gif. Also, pdaX running X is vastly faster than GPE X, though I prefer the security design etc of GPE and its fullscreen wm etc...

Oh, and I've ended up editing xmodmaps so I can map the silkscreen keys in GPE. Is there a way to map them in Opie? (Ideally, I want to set the E/J key to toggle between opie/gpe).

For xmodmap, I edited /etc/X11/xmodmap.shepherd and added the following
CODE
! Silkscreen
keycode 118 = XF86Launch0
keycode 119 = XF86Launch1
keycode 120 = XF86Launch2
keycode 121 = XF86Launch3
keycode 122 = XF86Launch4


Then editing /etc/keylaunchrc to assign commands.

- Bundabrg

(Excuse my rambles.. still sleep deprived)
*


OK, many thanks for this. To edit the wiki, just create a user account & then you should be able to....if you can update the wiki with this info that'd be great...I could do it, but it'd be better if you did, as you've got the experience of a working system, which is fantastic. smile.gif

zedkatuf
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zedkatuf2
post Jun 30 2006, 12:42 AM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 08:56 AM)
correct dependencies and 'fixup' scripts.

The only showstopper-bug I've noticed (coming from pdaXrom though) is that my SD card is really pissing me off. Can't copy a 100Mb file to it (debian) as it gets halfway and hangs the whole system. That only happened under extreme load on pdaX but it still happened so I think I must have a dud SD sad.gif. Also, pdaX running X is vastly faster than GPE X, though I prefer the security design etc of GPE and its fullscreen wm etc...


...do you mean that you tried to copy the file whilst running pdaX? Under OZ 3.5.4.1 my 2gig sd card is useable (so far!) with no similar probs.though admiteddly, I haven't tried copying a large file yet.

zedkatuf
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Bundabrg
post Jun 30 2006, 12:48 AM
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Hmmm, I'm not sure what you mean 'whilst running pdaX', since pdaX is running from the moment the kernel starts.

Under X under pdaXrom or under the console I was able to copy the debian tar file, extract it, and then execute stuff under it. If I execute an apt-get update though under the debian chroot, it churns the SD too hard and the Z loses connection to it. I could never work out if it was the poor SD driver sharp supplies or I had a crap SD card. My money is on the card though it works fine under windows.

Under OZ I can't even finish the first step before all hell breaks loose. However I think OZ uses a different SD driver which just exasperates the crappiness of my SD card.

On your 2Gb, are you able to download pocket workstation debian tgz (the 20Mb or so one) to it, then extract that tar to a directory on that card (IE, so its effectively reading AND writing to the card at the same time). If that works, I'm getting a new card wink.gif

Waaaay off topic. Sorry ;-)

- Bundabrg
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koen
post Jun 30 2006, 02:24 AM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 08:48 AM)
Under X under pdaXrom or under the console I was able to copy the debian tar file, extract it, and then execute stuff under it. If I execute an apt-get update though under the debian chroot, it churns the SD too hard and the Z loses connection to it.
*


People seem to never answer this question when it gets asked: what does the debian tar provide that you think OZ doesn't have?
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alee16
post Jun 30 2006, 04:24 AM
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I would like to install the OPIE/GPE setup, but I don't have a wireless card ohmy.gif . Is it possible just to download the packages (and their dependencies, I know it will take a while), or do I need to hook up my Z to the internet somehow (SL-C1000)?

Also, is there a list of dependencies for the packages that are needed?

Koen, while you're here, could you list the packages that are needed to print from your c700, or are they installed by default?

Thanks!
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poushag
post Jun 30 2006, 04:26 AM
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I also was interested in trying GPE and Opie together but my feeling was that I didn't want to run them simultaneously. I use a Collie and even if I didn't I would probably still feel this way. I use hentges Opie ROM with his Opie cardfs (on SD), which I recommend because if I have to reflash, I can easily restore the non-UI files I customized, such as fstab and ipkg.conf, using mhbackup. (mhbackup is a utility written by hentges) I don't suppose you have mhbackup on your ROM do you, Bundabrg?

The most basic customization I used was to partition the SD card FAT/ext2/ext2. The first partition is for the mhbackup and opie-backup archives (so I can transfer them to a workstation in case the Z gets stolen or bricked and I have to buy another one). The second and third partitions were meant to be Opie and GPE respectively. (But I think that I may end up going with only one ext2 partition.)

I wonder when using the two GUIs how easy it is to update to a newer version of Opie or GPE. Does anybody have insight into that? And I have had to reflash a few times already due to some corruption. If I upgrade a bunch of ipks, then I don't want to have to reinstall them all after a reflash (but running ipkg-link on the 2nd partition of the SD would be my preferred alternative). Bundabrg, can you please update the wiki on installing both GUIs and add a section on the implications of reflashing? (especially how to restore things that aren't part of the flash)

As for your problems with the inactive GUI suspending the Z, it seems like you need a way to pause the GUI process that has become inactive (and its child processes). Does anyone know if this is possible?

The power management features are too valuable to me to go without. So I would rather exit one GUI and start the other. Bundabrg, do you think you can update the wiki to explain how this would be done as an alternative to running both simultaneously?

Thanks.
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Bundabrg
post Jun 30 2006, 04:29 AM
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QUOTE(koen @ Jun 30 2006, 10:24 AM)
QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 08:48 AM)
Under X under pdaXrom or under the console I was able to copy the debian tar file, extract it, and then execute stuff under it. If I execute an apt-get update though under the debian chroot, it churns the SD too hard and the Z loses connection to it.
*


People seem to never answer this question when it gets asked: what does the debian tar provide that you think OZ doesn't have?
*



Koen, you're kidding right?

- Bundabrg
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koen
post Jun 30 2006, 04:41 AM
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QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 12:29 PM)
QUOTE(koen @ Jun 30 2006, 10:24 AM)
QUOTE(Bundabrg @ Jun 30 2006, 08:48 AM)
Under X under pdaXrom or under the console I was able to copy the debian tar file, extract it, and then execute stuff under it. If I execute an apt-get update though under the debian chroot, it churns the SD too hard and the Z loses connection to it.
*


People seem to never answer this question when it gets asked: what does the debian tar provide that you think OZ doesn't have?
*



Koen, you're kidding right?

- Bundabrg
*



I'm not kidding. I've heard comments l like "I installed debian for <foo>, because OZ doesn't have it" when people actually mean "I didn't search and didn't try ipkg install <foo>".
And as I hinted above when asked for specifics they don't reply, but start bitching about other stuff. So consider this a form of "calling your bluff".
So please provide a list of specific things you miss in OZ, and please see if they are actually missing or you are not looking hard enough.
Since nobody has been able to produce such a list we are still unable to add the missing parts to OZ, since people seem to be too lazy to tell us.

(yes, I'm annoyed, since I've asked this question too many times without getting any answer at all)
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Bundabrg
post Jun 30 2006, 04:47 AM
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Fair enough I suppose.
OZ has only a fraction of debians packages. Those that I use I'll eventually port over myself, but I find it faster in the short term to simply apt-get install them. I don't run the debian chroot via VNC (ugg), but rather have it come to the X display (in this case GPE).

Anyway, you wanted proof. Compare the output of 'apt-cache pkgnames' under debian to 'ipkg list' under OE. The set of names that are in apt but not ipkg are what OZ (and indeed any OS) is missing.

- Bundabrg
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Bundabrg
post Jun 30 2006, 05:04 AM
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QUOTE(alee16 @ Jun 30 2006, 12:24 PM)
I would like to install the OPIE/GPE setup, but I don't have a wireless card ohmy.gif .  Is it possible just to download the packages (and their dependencies, I know it will take a while), or do I need to hook up my Z to the internet somehow (SL-C1000)?

Also, is there a list of dependencies for the packages that are needed?

Koen, while you're here, could you list the packages that are needed to print from your c700, or are they installed by default?

Thanks!
*


Once I'm not holding my new daughter in one arm I'll grab my installed packages list. Theoretically you would only need these to install.

Otherwise, I _think_ you can get ipkg compiled for x86, then use it to 'download-only' the dependencies in the wiki, then dump all those files to cf/sd.

- Bundabrg
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