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> N810 Stuff
Capn_Fish
post Mar 21 2008, 02:40 PM
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My N810 came today (biggrin.gif), so here are some first thoughts/comparisons to the Zaurus:

-It's smaller
-Its screen doesn't seem quite as nice (seems similar to a ThinkPad LCD, not so much like a touchscreen)
-The keyboard is OK, worse than the Z's. You need to hold your thumbs parallel to the screen's long sides to type on the top row.
-Keymap is NOT set up for standard Linux use (/ is a key combo?!?)
-Poky doesn't work with the touchscreen (sad.gif), Angstrom results with a normal image soon.
-It appears to be difficult to brick (no restore menu, but other detects USB on boot, can flash it from there)
-The battery door feels flimsy when removed from the device, solid otherwise

More to come!
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speculatrix
post Mar 21 2008, 04:44 PM
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I must admit I was disappointed by reviews of the keyboard, that when slid out the top row was too close to the edge... still not good enough to persuade me to sell my Z. I've even thought about about trying to make a cradle/clamshell adaptor for the N800, but getting a keyboard just the right size is tricky - I bought a nintendo aluminium case which would actually work quite well!
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ArchiMark
post Mar 25 2008, 06:04 PM
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Hey Capn, just noticed that you got your N810!

Since it's been a few days now, hopefully you've gotten more accustomed to the keyboard...

wink.gif


What do you think now??

As I said in another post, the N810 is definitely a different animal than the Z.....

tongue.gif




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Capn_Fish
post Mar 25 2008, 06:18 PM
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So far I've been pretty disappointed:

-Keyboard still is irritating (will be better with remapping)
-SD slot is REALLY hard to remove cards from
-The filesystem is messed up (where the heck is "Documents"?!?)
-Debian won't boot yet, Angstrom won't boot, Poky's touchscreen won't work (in other words, the whole reason I got the N810 has been voided)
-No native compiler/dev tools
-Fanoush's initfs (required for SD booting) is difficult to make work

Other than that, the extra RAM is nice, and the screen is reminiscent of the ThinkPad's (which I like). Once some usable second-party distro boots, I'll be happier.

EDIT:
-getting root access is a pain
-interface eats too much RAM, is hard to customize
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ArchiMark
post Mar 25 2008, 06:39 PM
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QUOTE(Capn_Fish @ Mar 25 2008, 07:18 PM) *
So far I've been pretty disappointed:

-Keyboard still is irritating (will be better with remapping)
-SD slot is REALLY hard to remove cards from
-The filesystem is messed up (where the heck is "Documents"?!?)
-Debian won't boot yet, Angstrom won't boot, Poky's touchscreen won't work (in other words, the whole reason I got the N810 has been voided)
-No native compiler/dev tools
-Fanoush's initfs (required for SD booting) is difficult to make work

Other than that, the extra RAM is nice, and the screen is reminiscent of the ThinkPad's (which I like). Once some usable second-party distro boots, I'll be happier.

EDIT:
-getting root access is a pain
-interface eats too much RAM, is hard to customize


Gee, Capn, almost get the impression that you're not happy with the N810...

wink.gif

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Capn_Fish
post Mar 26 2008, 03:27 AM
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The hardware: ~90-95% pleased
The software: ~30-45% pleased

So it ought to be nice with a new OS.
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BarryW
post Mar 26 2008, 05:54 AM
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I'd like to see some close ups of the sliding mechanism. There might be a way to extend the tracks a bit if it's plastic.
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speculatrix
post Mar 26 2008, 06:50 AM
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QUOTE(Capn_Fish @ Mar 26 2008, 02:18 AM) *
-Keyboard still is irritating (will be better with remapping)
-SD slot is REALLY hard to remove cards from
-The filesystem is messed up (where the heck is "Documents"?!?)
-Debian won't boot yet, Angstrom won't boot, Poky's touchscreen won't work (in other words, the whole reason I got the N810 has been voided)
-No native compiler/dev tools
-Fanoush's initfs (required for SD booting) is difficult to make work

Other than that, the extra RAM is nice, and the screen is reminiscent of the ThinkPad's (which I like). Once some usable second-party distro boots, I'll be happier.

EDIT:
-getting root access is a pain
-interface eats too much RAM, is hard to customize


hmm, I'm sorry that my doubts have been confirmed. I have a 6000 - bought soon after an 860 - and I found the keyboard was irritating enough to drive me back to the 860.

documents? there's a MyDocs directory and in there are directories like .documents & .sounds & .videos where you put your data. I removed all the dirs and made them symlinks to the SD card. Yeah, no idea what joker thought of that one!

there's lots of good repos of software, for which you need to enable "red pill" mode (someone was a fan of the matrix), and this gives you access to lots of goodies (canola media player, games, utilities). hmm, can't find a native compiler myself. You'll have to learn Python :-)
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nilch
post Mar 26 2008, 07:12 AM
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On the software note - from a user perspective and not a hackability perspective, I am actually happier with the OS2008 on N810 than the Zaurus.
The N810 allows me to do more in terms of daily life usage , than the Z in these areas
Skype/Gizmo
Chat online
Connect to Internet by 3G thru BT for constant internet access
Podcast support and listening and downloading - all in one device - on the Z it was a bit more difficult to do all .
Good Video and media player
Very good browser support and flash support - plus support for mobile versions of sites (and iPhone versions)

On hackability and tweaking perspective, the Z did allow more to be done. But again I always want to use my device first and then tweak and hack. The same was true on my Zaurus C1000. In that useage sense, I do like the N810 and what is provides right now.

Of course, I do miss many other aspects of the Zaurus , and do now and again fire up my Z.




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stupkid
post Mar 26 2008, 09:27 AM
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A co-worker of mine has a N770 and N800. He loves it and it does seem to have a lot of out of the box functionality and there are some cool projects being worked on for the NITs. I am a little dismayed at what I read about the hardware though. There is so much more potential for things like accelerated 3D, and superior video playback, but the device was not put together by Nokia to fully exploit this hardware, which is a little annoying. It is a cool device none the less.

I will stick with my Z for now and wait a bit longer to see if there is another hardware release from Nokia or how good the Neo1973 (screen seems a bit too tiny) when it is released.
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speculatrix
post Mar 26 2008, 03:10 PM
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QUOTE(nilch @ Mar 26 2008, 03:12 PM) *
On the software note - from a user perspective and not a hackability perspective, I am actually happier with the OS2008 on N810 than the Zaurus.
The N810 allows me to do more in terms of daily life usage , than the Z in these areas
Skype/Gizmo
Chat online
Connect to Internet by 3G thru BT for constant internet access
Podcast support and listening and downloading - all in one device - on the Z it was a bit more difficult to do all .
Good Video and media player
Very good browser support and flash support - plus support for mobile versions of sites (and iPhone versions)

On hackability and tweaking perspective, the Z did allow more to be done. But again I always want to use my device first and then tweak and hack. The same was true on my Zaurus C1000. In that useage sense, I do like the N810 and what is provides right now.

Of course, I do miss many other aspects of the Zaurus , and do now and again fire up my Z.


You've highlighted things the Z will probably never have: Skype and Flash.

Skype could be a make or break deal for some; the SIP/VOIP clients on Zaurus, especially for Cacko, have not been magnificent, not sure if latest Ekiga or similar on Angstrom are good.

I've had bluetooth networking via PAN, and also using a 3G phone working just fine, it's just PPP over RFCOMM over BT!

There was a nice shoutcast client for QT; I think Quasar addressed many weaknesses.

The Nokia also has working sat nav, whereas the Z only has it using a hacked-up tomtom application.
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nilch
post Mar 26 2008, 06:20 PM
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QUOTE(speculatrix @ Mar 26 2008, 07:10 PM) *
You've highlighted things the Z will probably never have: Skype and Flash.

Skype could be a make or break deal for some; the SIP/VOIP clients on Zaurus, especially for Cacko, have not been magnificent, not sure if latest Ekiga or similar on Angstrom are good.

I've had bluetooth networking via PAN, and also using a 3G phone working just fine, it's just PPP over RFCOMM over BT!

There was a nice shoutcast client for QT; I think Quasar addressed many weaknesses.

The Nokia also has working sat nav, whereas the Z only has it using a hacked-up tomtom application.


Very true and a good point you bought up about the GPS. Actually as a in-car device and in-pocket too the N810 doubles up pretty good.

In the car GPS and media player come in handy (am looking forward to Canola Car edition).
Actually for the Zaurus I invested in a Wifi Card, but held back from the BT card. True the Zaurus did offer this with the add-ons.
IN fact while I was a loud mouth supporting separate add-on expandability paradigm of the Zaurus, but now with the built-in wifi and BT on the N810, I am spoilt and feel foolish about my earlier stance. Makes you realize how viewpoints change with different perspectives.

On the promise of better things to come for the Nokia IT, I am looking forward to better QT support on the IT with Nokia purchase of Trolltech.
Also the noBounds project looks promising... and the supposed developments of Diablo (OS2008 revision) should stir up a few things.

And yes, I should mention, there is already a kernel hack to get rotation supported on OS2008. In fact Canola using this hack supports portrait mode media player too (don't know why Nokia left this out, all modern handheld OS's should support rotation).

BTW Capn_Fish, getting root access is as easy as installing one software (becomeroot) from the repositories. I didn't really find it that hard (except that its not in-built, maybe as a security concern).
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Capn_Fish
post Mar 27 2008, 08:33 AM
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I already have root access, but why do you have to type "sudo gainroot" when "su" was invented? Seriously...

EDIT: That's a rhetorical question, BTW. I realize they probably have a good reason for it, but I STILL want to be able to simply "su"
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speculatrix
post Mar 27 2008, 08:48 AM
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QUOTE(Capn_Fish @ Mar 27 2008, 04:33 PM) *
I already have root access, but why do you have to type "sudo gainroot" when "su" was invented? Seriously...

EDIT: That's a rhetorical question, BTW. I realize they probably have a good reason for it, but I STILL want to be able to simply "su"


"alias su sudo"

:-P
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Capn_Fish
post Mar 27 2008, 12:20 PM
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Or, more to the point:

CODE
alias su "sudo gainroot"
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