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deckard73
Hello

After playing around to compile some smaller programs native on rc9,
I today got emacs running. It compiles right, after linking /usr/lib/crt c-runtime stuff
from the zgcc image. This is very dirty and may cause problems, but so far it works.
On console it works perfectly. On X you can do emacs --font 7x14 -g 80x26
if you have problems with font or size.

The next good news is that if emacs runs, probably vm runs, too.
VM is the mail-client of my dreams, so I mentioned it here.
google for "wonderworks vm"
Here it compiles right. After installing it should work

That shows the power of pdaxrom. Next week i will donate to this project (guys).

But ... here is my suggestion. What about a list of programs that compile right on pdaxrom.
That would be a good start for a <pdaxrom from scratch> project.

Unfortunally the arm part of www.linuxfromscratch.org looks not maintained anymore.
Lets do some compensation

I am eager to hear from you about this topic

ciao
Enno
Laze
hmmm.. Then next website has to be completed before we add any new things.
ScottYelich
I'm trying to remember when I first ran VM.... 1989? I haven't seen Kyle around in a long time.

Where do you get VM these days?

Scott
jh
Still available here:
Wonderworks - VM. Kyle was MIA for a year, popped into the gnu.emacs.vm.info newsgroup a month or so ago and said he's still around, then disappeared again. VM is great... ran it for 10 years until I recently switched to gnus for everything.

Nice to hear emacs is available... I'll give it a shot once I get a C-xxxx?.

jason
jandr
For something similar to but a little lighter than emacs, you can try jed.
I got the ipk from here.
It installed & runs fine on rc8, and you can delete the helpfiles to save about a Meg of space.
emjaybee
Maybe I don't understand the purpose of this project. I use Gentoo on my laptop and I'm familiar with linuxfromscratch.org and I understand the benefits of compiling your software to take advantage of the bells and whistles that your hardware has. I was under the impression that the IPK files are designed for the Zaurus in mind, so wouldn't they already be optimized? Wouldn't it be easier to install an IPK that's already optimized for your hardware instead of compiling everything?
deckard73
Hi

QUOTE(emjaybee @ Mar 24 2005, 02:59 AM)
Maybe I don't understand the purpose of this project.  I use Gentoo on my laptop and I'm familiar with linuxfromscratch.org and I understand the benefits of compiling your software to take advantage of the bells and whistles that your hardware has.  I was under the impression that the IPK files are designed for the Zaurus in mind, so wouldn't they already be optimized?  Wouldn't it be easier to install an IPK that's already optimized for your hardware instead of compiling everything?
*


Okay. Some arguments. Sure it is easier to install an ipk package, but what if there is no ipk package or the ipk package is configured another way? Best example is the busybox package. In some environments it fits perfectly, but on my cl 860 with 1 gb cf card there is enough space to use a full vi binary. Next one. I use less instead of more. more is less powerful than less (nice sentence wink.gif

What about gnu chess - xboard. what about a newer autoconf, automake, libtool. what about squeak?
Run the whole offline wiki on your pda. never install the kde stuff if you dont like it.
If you compile yourself you can remember the configuration if something went wrong,. You say, you are familiar with lfs. look http://www.hu.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/whatislfs.html

By the way. You installed pdaxrom. And not the original zaurus stuff. Is this really easier to use?

use what suite your needs, know the dependencies. doing clean ports. you like fvwm but it has problems (dont know) to run. fine. look at the error message, fix it, describe the issue. inform other users.
discuss it. get the most stable linux around. be creative

linux is not linux, but it is great if the same environment on pda and desktop exists. On my working platform is a 2 years old lfs running. I patched only security fixes. Because it is a production system.
If it is "ready" you can create a backup image. I will never get back to Suse or something like that. If 2 years end, I compile the now current lfs from my "old" installed lfs.

And think of optimization and ipks. smile.gif

QUOTE
Premature optimization is the root of all evil -- CarHoare


Nevertheless, I thank you for your objection. This gives me the chance to explain my idea.

ciao
Enno
emjaybee
You raise a lot of good arguments, most of them why I looked at LFS for awhile when playing with Linux distros. I like to be a control freak at times on my system so I'd compile a program from source so I could customize it how I saw fit. The problem is what if I didn't want the program anymore? I'd have to look through half a dozen directories and remove related files, and still not know if I got them all. So I tried installing software into seperate folders using --prefix and --exec-prefix on the ./configure script. This made removing or upgrading programs a lot easier, but I'd have to symlink binaries and libraries.

LFS lets you optimize the software by compiling it, a distro like Red Hat doesn't optimize the software by compiling it but manages packages for when you want to upgrade or uninstall, but why I settled on Gentoo was because emerge compiles the software AND keeps track of what files go where for easy uninstall.

I'd love to try out emacs on my C860 since as one of your arguments there isn't an IPK for it (and XEmacs is not the same). Maybe you can post a guide on how you did it and make it easy to update or uninstall in the future. smile.gif

What pdaXrom needs is emerge and the portage tree ported to the Z!! biggrin.gif
deckard73
Hello

QUOTE(emjaybee @ Mar 24 2005, 09:49 PM)
The problem is what if I didn't want the program anymore?  I'd have to look through half a dozen directories and remove related files, and still not know if I got them all.  So I tried installing software into seperate folders using --prefix and --exec-prefix on the ./configure script.  This made removing or upgrading programs a lot easier, but I'd have to symlink binaries and libraries.


Thats why I write down all changes I made on the system. like compile options, configure flags etc.
Most of the Gnu-Soft behaves okay und installs the files in well known directories. Most come
with a Makefile. There is a switch (was it -n?) that only print the commands before doing. I pipe the output into a file and look before installing where the files go. I backup this file. Okay, this takes time. Its worth.
A good place to look is /usr/local/{share,man,doc,bin,etc}. But I am sure you know that
Emacs e.g. behaves very well. Dont forget to backup the .emacs.d stuff and .emacs smile.gif

QUOTE(emjaybee @ Mar 24 2005, 09:49 PM)
LFS lets you optimize the software by compiling it, a distro like Red Hat doesn't optimize the software by compiling it but manages packages for when you want to upgrade or uninstall, but why I settled on Gentoo was because emerge compiles the software AND keeps track of what files go where for easy uninstall.


I did not use rpm, but read something about src.rpms. They contain all the information how to install somewhere/somehow. I didnt know emerge, too. But sounds good if a tracker could do this automation.
I have to say, that I didnt even know the ipk format, heard it looks similiar to the debian stuff.

QUOTE(emjaybee @ Mar 24 2005, 09:49 PM)
I'd love to try out emacs on my C860 since as one of your arguments there isn't an IPK for it (and XEmacs is not the same).  Maybe you can post a guide on how you did it and make it easy to update or uninstall in the future.  smile.gif
What pdaXrom needs is emerge and the portage tree ported to the Z!!  biggrin.gif
*


Uuh. Hard hit. As I mentioned above I write down all changes on the system, I talked about the desktop computer smile.gif
I did not setup the whole zaurus system, just playing around so far. I could be wrong, but at this stage it needs great effort to compile the whole system. Look at the double grep binaries eg. autoconf issues.
It is worth if you can setup a base system from source like the lfs toolchain.
I never compiled a kernel for zaurus nor a gcc, not even autoconf by myself. I will try this next week.

So far it were only minor changes. Some links from zgcc image to /usr/lib/crt* (the c runtime stuff)
And there was a problem with a doubled grep. In /bin and in the zgcc Image is a grep. I removed /bin/grep. Hmm. LFS keeps track of such things. No wonder. The x86 community is much bigger there

I can remember the following

install texinfo (I did it from source, but a ipk might good here)
install perl (I used the ipk, too lazy to compile)
install libpcre (ipk)

maybe the order is wrong

emacs needs only the generic procedure: configure && make all && make install

Some things I really miss in the standard rom are bzip2, less (did both manually) and the updatedb/locate, whereis functionality. (next week)

And yes. I am a control freak too. Discover problems/bugs is fun in linux. Especially if you debug high level stuff.

The choice of my employer is windows. Because of the good support. The shiny area on the top of my head says more than thousand words.

Never mind
Enno
darmabum
As for XEmacs, I can attest that the pckg available at unstable is 90% fine. I've been incrementally trying many packages and most work although an ftp process error prevents (so far) the online package updater, and online connections such as efs from connecting. Given other modem problems I have I'm not sure who to blame.

Some asides: Dired failed to load until I recompiled the lisp files. Now it's excellent. Ediff is also cranky. My goal: xslide...
darmabum
As for the ftp problem, it seems I needed to install the net clients package (the ftp programs weren't allowing xemacs to play). Now, everything seems to work like a charm. I have installed most xemacs packages using the internal installer, including vm and gnus, as well as psgml and xslide, and it all WORKS!!

So, XEmacs in your pocket...not bad.
darmabum
One final note regarding XEmacs with xslt. I'm using xslide and it's fully functional, but transforms with xt break due to a java error. Xsltproc, however, works fine.
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