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bam
totally killer! I know what my next project is...as soon as he puts up the schematics...


wait 802.11b....wifi? wonder if there is room for that....after the microdrive-->cf upgrade.
Antikx
QUOTE(Boris @ Feb 21 2006, 08:23 PM)
Man, you rule!
*


So say we all!
speculatrix
indeed, albertr, if you started converting 3100's, you'd have people queing up for them.

if you could offer both bluetooth AND wifi, you'd be fighting people off with a sharp stick!

one little thing though... does the USB wifi adaptor support WPA? the SL6000's wifi is usb prism thing and as far as I know there's no WPA support yet.
albertr
Prism3 usb chipset is supported by wlan-ng drivers only afaik, so no WPA support for it.

I do have another usb dongle that uses ZyDAS ZD1211 chipset, and its Linux driver while is alittle bit funky, has WPA/WPA2 support. But there's no OBSD driver exists.

The plan is to have both wi-fi and bt on my C1K in near future (C1K has plenty of free space inside the case). I'm tied up with other projects, but I hope to take a look at BTUART lines sometime soon.
-albertr
Da_Blitz
I am so happy now all i need is a small hub and to build a false bottom for my c3k!! wifi and bluetooth here i come.

now i can have the mini connector for client mode and and have a full sized connector at the back so i dont need a connector.

you are thinking too small, get a dlink with the athereos chipset and get 802.11g, even if you cant use the extra speed you should see a range improvment for 802.11g routers (better modulation scheme) and yes i am aware that you cant reach full 802.11 speeds but when did you ever reach the max with any wifi gear smile.gif
speculatrix
I agree that we want 802.11g with WPA.

for work I got an Intel minipci 2915abg adaptor, and it suddenly occurred to me that if we had a minipci adaptor, perhaps thru a "sled", on the zaurus then things would get very interesting.
Da_Blitz
would be nice but wont work without a bridge chip sad.gif they exsist but you dont want to know how much work it is and the garentee that your zarus will not work for awhile (this is why i keep a backup PDA, i use them so often that its handy to have a reserve)

dont suppose we could get a pic of where you soldered the lines so i can start modding?
albertr
I think there's a possibility that I have found the BTUART lines too.
For these who are waiting for pictures and schemantics - I'll post it this Sunday night. Not sure that I would have all pictures ready by that time, but I'll post what I have.
-albertr
Da_Blitz
Yeah sorry bout that, i tend to forget about time zones (im GMT +10 ie sydney)

the uart would be nice but i think it is secondary, IMHO haging everything off the usb bus is a better idea., however if you want to save space by leaving out the hub then its a great idea

cant wait to be the second pearson to do this smile.gif
albertr
Take a look here:

http://www.iral.com/~albertr/linux/zaurus/wireless/

I didn't have time to post all pictures including BTUART, I hope to do it sometime next weekend.

-albertr
Da_Blitz
THat was very informative, espesially the part about the regulator catching fire smile.gif, one thing i might mention because i am unsure if you nticed it but PORT 2 is MULTIPLEXED with the USB client port meaning you can have PORT 2 and client at the same time smile.gif

not that i am worried about losing usb client if i gain wifi, however i just noticed that USB host ports would fit perfectly in the 2nd CF slot and it would be easy to have 2 smile.gif

as for yaur power calculations it would be the Voltage drop across the regulator * current accross the device so power in watts (P) = ((voltage to the chip) -5v) * 500ma or for those not comfterble with unit conversion in electronics P = (Vin - 5) * 0.5 i would assunme this chip is getting about 5v to 6v so at 6v it would be 0.5 watt smile.gif

power disipation can be improved by lowering the voltage, cool ambeint temp, active cooling (fan or peltier) heatsink (mainly for disipating heat not moving it) if you look at my calacs above i would say the chip is getting 5v or 2 * battery voltage it depends if it is getting its power off the zarus,s 5v rail or has another arangment (like a voltage doubler)

atm i am wondering how hard it would be to repackage my zaurus and blend it with my targus keyboard and add VGA out, or mabey i should finish porting linux to the Dell x30 and use that instead. (it has a nice daughter board that has 802.11b on the CF bus and bluetooth connected to the BTUART)

BTUART support would be good as it has a larger buffer for comms
bam
I think this is enough to install my mini bt module(usb dongle ripped apart)
Boris
QUOTE(albertr @ Feb 27 2006, 07:03 AM)
Take a look here:

Nice work Albert!

About your concerns about 3850 power dissipation: if it powered from 5V rails we can assume that it will be in 4.9 - 5.6V range. For input voltage below 5.17V power dissipation will be 0.5A * 0.17V = 85mW which will get the chip slightly warm.
At input of 5.6V it will be 0.5A * 0.6V = 300mW which isn't also very high. Unfortunately, datasheet doesn't specify case thermal resistance to ambient so I can only guess that the chip temperature will be within 60C which is well in range of working
temperature. In addition, this IC have thermal protection, so it should be safe to draw 500mA from it.
bam
QUOTE(Boris @ Feb 27 2006, 12:21 AM)
QUOTE(albertr @ Feb 27 2006, 07:03 AM)
Take a look here:

Nice work Albert!

About your concerns about 3850 power dissipation: if it powered from 5V rails we can assume that it will be in 4.9 - 5.6V range. For input voltage below 5.17V power dissipation will be 0.5A * 0.17V = 85mW which will get the chip slightly warm.
At input of 5.6V it will be 0.5A * 0.6V = 300mW which isn't also very high. Unfortunately, datasheet doesn't specify case thermal resistance to ambient so I can only guess that the chip temperature will be within 60C which is well in range of working
temperature. In addition, this IC have thermal protection, so it should be safe to draw 500mA from it.
*



you could always use thermal epoxy and a small chunk of aluminum... biggrin.gif
maslovsky
I wonder if there is a wasy to have both client and host funcitonality...

Albert, if your driver is unloaded and internal USB host is powered down, can then Sharp's driver along with usb-monitor be loaded and used? In this case this could be some kind of a solution - a way to switch back and forth between using internal USB devices and external USB port.
albertr
Thanks for the information on heat dissipation! I'll try to replace the resistor with the smaller one and see if it can power up a wi-fi module without setting the Zaurus on fire wink.gif

As far as the driver goes, I think it should be possible to load/unload it, but remember to power off 5V OTG regulator before connecting to another host which supports its own power. That was done automatically in Sharp's driver, but I moved this part to userland utility. The clocks are turned off on un-loading the driver the same way as it's done in Sharp's.
Does anyone know how usbd drivers get loaded?
-albertr
albertr
QUOTE(Da_Blitz @ Feb 26 2006, 10:41 PM)
one thing i might mention because i am unsure if you nticed it but PORT 2 is MULTIPLEXED with the USB client port meaning you can have PORT 2 and client at the same time smile.gif



Yes, lines are multiplexed, so it's either client or host port2, but not both at the same time.
-albertr
Tom61
Cool! I was wondering if Sharp had brought out the second PXA270 USB port to somewhere easy to get to, and they did!
bam
would it be safe to say if a piece of hardware worked on one sub port it will work on the other in question?
Reaper
It's really cool you've made it that far. cool.gif I just haven't got two things:
1) What is the current version of your BT chipset that you've soldered? It would be nice to have 1.2 or even 2.0;

and

2) Is it technically possible (by overclocking and so on) to use any soldered BT chipset to reach true USB speeds like some Mbps? I'm interested in it because of the pretty usable audio profiles like A2DP and because of BT headphones that would be nice to connect to my C3k. biggrin.gif
Da_Blitz
A2DP works with 1.0 (i have the logitech headphones) but linux support is in the early stages (only supports uLaw 16bit @ 44khz throgh a named pipe, the pipe being the problem)

i dont think i explained clearly with wy multiplex post, Cant PORT 2 be routed out the client pins or to its own pins, i seem to remeber that it had its own IO's for normal usage meaning that there might be another usb port on the board, this would allow you to have port 2 and client at the same time.

just found a nice tiny USB bluetooth dongle thats 14mm wide and 23 mm deep (without antenna, i plan to solder one on) in australia, teseting it now but lookslike i might need to load firmware into it
Da_Blitz
just started doing some thinking and recalled that some new laptops had accelermoters in them, do you know where the i2c bus is, i was thinking i could plug one in then shake my pda to go to a random song or swing clockwise to go forward and anti clockwise to go back

wasent sure if you came across it, hope you did, then i could also park the HD heads on falling

[EDIT] SPI would be good as well but im not afraid of a little pic micro glue logic [/EDIT]
albertr
The bluetooth dongle used is the old revision of Billionton Class 2 USB dongle. It's bt spec 1.1 certified, has both UART and USB interfaces available and traced on PCB and supports CSR proprientary BCSP protocol which allows to get away without using hardware flow control in UART mode. More info is here:

http://www.iral.com/~albertr/billionton/

-albertr
Tom61
QUOTE(Da_Blitz @ Feb 28 2006, 10:15 AM)
just started doing some thinking and recalled that some new laptops had accelermoters in them, do you know where the i2c bus is, i was thinking i could plug one in then shake my pda to go to a random song or swing clockwise to go forward and anti clockwise to go back

wasent sure if you came across it, hope you did, then i could also park the HD heads on falling

[EDIT] SPI would be good as well but im not afraid of a little pic micro glue logic [/EDIT]
*


You might be interested in the old Itsy prototype. Itsy was a Compaq project to make PDA that could be replicated cheaply by hobbyists, and featured an accelerometer that was API accessible. I have a video of Doom being played on it by rocking it in the direction you wanted to move.

Wasn't there a recent patent (by Apple maybe?) patenting a gesture system clearly designed to be used by a device with an accelerometer? (It was covered by a news site)

You might see if you can find a USB gamepad that's small enough to be intergrated that uses an accelerometer. I have Sidewinder Freestyle Pro gamepad with one (very fun to use it with the included motorcycle game), however, it's far too large to be intergrated.
speculatrix
QUOTE(Tom61 @ Feb 28 2006, 08:29 PM)
You might see if you can find a USB gamepad that's small enough to be intergrated that uses an accelerometer.
*


check out opentom as the TT Go 500 and 700 have accelerometers in them for dead-reckoning (to deduce velocity changes during temporary GPS lock loss)... so that means there's already a driver and stuff.
Da_Blitz
Got the dongle working, it dosnt play nice with hubs, work great and is tiny!!!!! cant wait to put it in, will just have to wait till this weekend so i con sond off for the prototype SBC
albertr
Congrats! Is it BT or wi-fi dongle?
-albertr
Da_Blitz
i meant on my PC, and its that tiny bluetooth one, its even smaller than the ones on your site (its a fraction larger than the usb connector, but as i said it goes inside my zaurus this weekend, i just have to send the prototype for my single board computer off to be manufactured and i might get the 1GB cxx00 RAM hack board done as well to save time and money, it should be easy to do now that all you need is a soldering iorn
bam
1Gb ram? O_o, all I want is 256Mb, that would be nice...smile.gif my bt dongle is going in next month(have to save for my microdrive replacement.
adf
QUOTE(bam @ Mar 1 2006, 08:33 PM)
1Gb ram? O_o, all I want is 256Mb, that would be nice...smile.gif my bt dongle is going in next month(have to save for my microdrive replacement.
*

What ever happened to bt/wifi/ram upgrade on the 3100? Anyone able? anyone done any of it?
Mjolinor
I am going to bid on 10 of these
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-OEM-Complete-Blu...1QQcmdZViewItem

Anyone in the UK want some and I'll post them out when they arrive?

Don't mind doing Europe as well but it will probably be cheaper to buy them yourself with postage costs.
albertr
Looks like Ericsson is liquidating it, I saw quite a few offering of them on a reel. I assume you read the datasheet and know that they require external 50Ohm antenna?
-albertr
Mjolinor
QUOTE(albertr @ Mar 2 2006, 02:52 PM)
I assume you read the datasheet and know that they require external 50Ohm antenna?
-albertr
*


Yup. I'll make the antenna smile.gif
albertr
I need a help from someone with experience in electronic engineering... I'd like to implement some power switching circuit thru PNP transistor (or MOS FET?) for built-in Wi-Fi and BT modules. I think I found GPIO lines that could be used to control the switch, but need a help with schemantics and advise on what kind of transistor to use.

Vin and Vout would be either 3.3V or 5V, and max current would be about 500-650mA @ 5V. Also I'd like to minimize any parasitic effects and power drain. Switching speed is not important.
-albertr
albertr
Nevermind, I think I got it.
-albertr
Da_Blitz
All you need is a resistor and a transitor the resisistor sits between the transistor and thi IO pin, you wauld also want a high gain transistor ro arange 2 transistors in a darlington array
albertr
QUOTE
About your concerns about 3850 power dissipation: if it powered from 5V rails we can assume that it will be in 4.9 - 5.6V range.  For input voltage below 5.17V power dissipation will be 0.5A * 0.17V = 85mW which will get the chip slightly warm.
At input of 5.6V it will be 0.5A * 0.6V = 300mW which isn't also very high.  Unfortunately, datasheet doesn't specify case thermal resistance to ambient so I can only guess that the chip temperature will be within 60C which is well in range of working
temperature.  In addition, this IC have thermal protection, so it should be safe to draw 500mA from it.


I replaced the resistor with a 1K one, but it looks like there might be a problem for this regulator to supply high current. I've tried two different wi-fi dongles, and both of them seem to have problems when powered from it.
-albertr
albertr
Well, scratch that - the problem seemed to be unrelated to power supply. I got the internal wi-fi module working when powered from that regulator.
-albertr
JohnX
That's great! I can't wait to hear how the reception once the Zaurus is put back together. This is making me very happy to have a C1000. biggrin.gif
Boris
QUOTE(albertr @ Mar 6 2006, 06:29 PM)
Well, scratch that - the problem seemed to be unrelated to power supply. I got the internal wi-fi module working when powered from that regulator.

Ok. You may try to measure voltages before and after 3850 to get the picture. If that will not reveal any problems, then the problem might be in too large voltage spikes on USB power line during various modes of operation. These can be identfied only with a scope.
albertr
Thanks, Boris! Unfortunately, I don't have the o'scope. But anyway, it seems to be working for two days in a row now - over 1GB of data transferred over wi-fi.
ZD1211 gets pretty hot, but so far it seems stable. I attached its metal electromagnetic shield (that covers RF) to Zaurus's metal plate under the keypad. Not sure if it's helping to dissipate the heat, since the other side of it (where ZD1211 soldered to) gets pretty hot too.
-albertr
speculatrix
the auction closed, and not many bidders - I went for three of them, on the basis that there's one to hack, one for real work, and one spare just in case!

I'll let you know when mine arrive.
Da_Blitz
I just had an evil thoght, scince no one uses the serial port on the back and it is TTL, why not do an internal gprs modem hack using an old doner phone (clamshell without screen or batt, MOBO only)

i am running out of space and i havent even started soldering yet (thogh i did add bluetooth internally to 2 linksys NSLU's)

im thinking a docking staitoin as i want 2 wifi cards and a bluetooth w/ external antennas )3 of them smile.gif) and gprs, might as well put my external battery in there as well to power the beast

considering that my USB hub and bluetooth card are smaller than a CF card when the 2 are placed next to each other (got to love sydney's china town) and tho mobile being about the thickness of a CF card then my doking station wont be 2 small, if i could just find someone wh o could redesign the bottom half of the case then i would be really happy
Torsten Wagner
Hi,

Just followed the thread recently and it sounds quite interesting. I'm not very deeply involved in the hardware of the Z. Therefore, I just have some question to understand and hopefully further help in development.

1. Is there enough space to add beside the WLAN and Bluetooth-Card an additional memory stick? I really like to see my C1000 with a internal storage of more then 1 GB.

2. Did you plane to use one USB port of the Zaurus with an additional USB-Hub to connect all these devices with the Zaurus or will you use all USB ports of the Zaurus itself? Did you manage to find out for what the ports (which are used for USB) of the Zaurus are used instead (since they have normally double or triple functions)

3. Any idea about the overall power consumption? One problem which maybe even leads Sharp to include no internal devices is the ratio between weight, size / battery life. It is still a PDA and should fit size and weight criteria. Our Zaurus devices are already on the upper limit in this case. Small a light device requires small batteries and therefore low power consumption for useable battery lifetimes. No space (in terms of electricity) for additional gadgets?!?

Personal I believe that the battery of the Zaurus is already somewhat too small in capacity for a PDA. Intensive use with sometimes WLAN force me to recharge the Zaurus every second day - sometimes daily. It would cut the fun if I have to charge it twice a day because of internal Bluetooth, WLAN etc. Therefore, if we like to integrate more devices, we should check whether we have to tune the power unit as well.

4. For the heating effects of the power regulator (?). As far as I remember the pictures correctly, there was still little space. Maybe it helps to use a little copper sheet together with some thermal grease.

I will try to support this project. Unfortunately I have just one Zaurus which I daily use. Disassembling this unit is not really what I want. smile.gif
However, I'm sitting here in a lab with a huge bunch of electronic tools and devices. Even a PCB-milling-drilling-whatever machine can be used here.
Therefore, if I can assist you, I will try my best.

Best regards

Torsten
Da_Blitz
I am going down the hub path as it allows me to avoid a couplu of issues such as turning power to a device off (ass the hub does this, i only have to turn off the hub)

there is not much room in the case, if you have a c1000 then you are in luck as you have the internal CF slot free, otherwise you can have a bluetooth dongle and thas about it, you can gain more space if you dont want the second CF slot (the external one) and want 2 full sized USB host ports instead or dump the SD slot and gain a bit of space

with the C3000 you might want to consider a usb socket somewhere or build a docking station

the C100 could have bluetooth wifi and storage if you boght a small sized flash disk and got creative but at tah point you would need a hub

a soulution to bad battery life is an external battery pack but not everyone likes this
albertr
If you are wondering about these soldering pads...

http://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=17937&st=77#

-albertr
speculatrix
hmm.
so, basically, you can't fit the bluetooth adaptor whilst the internal CF slot is in use whether by microdrive or CF card - you'd have to use flying leads to the BT adaptor, or maybe a ribbon cable for a CF card to move it out of the area.

bummer.
albertr
C3x00:
I doubt that you can relocate the microdrive - there's simply not enough space elsewhere. But finding a place for a small BT module might be a possibility. In this case the flying leads can be used to connect it to BTUART lines.
C1K:
There're plenty of space available.

-albertr
JohnX
albertr: I was wondering if you've noticed any difference in reception for your internal wifi mod vs a CF wifi card? If there isn't a significant difference or the internal wifi dongle does better, then I might be interested in paying someone to solder a wifi dongle (and maybe bluetooth) into my C1000. wink.gif
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