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doseas
Just saw this:
http://www.linuxdevices.com/cgi-bin/printe...id=NS7056225751

Anyone care to comment??
Mickeyl
Very interesting. As far as I know, neither the OpenZaurus nor the Opie team have been officially contacted regarding these "customizations to the OpenZaurus, Opie, and other open source project code bases that improve usability". Appreciating patches biggrin.gif
Anonymous
This sounds cool. OZ seems to be lagging behind anyway.
Mickeyl
Behind what?
Anonymous
This is good news! The more the merrier!

Zack
Anonymous
Is there any indication that the Lycoris ROM will support the 5600? It seems like 5600 owners are stuck with the Sharp ROM, and a lot of FAQs and HOW-TOs give instructions that don't apply to the 5600 (though that's not always clear until you try to follow them). It would be nice to have a well-supported alternative ROM.
nasteratu
I know in the article Lycoris said it would syc with thier OS, I am wondeirng if this will be a Lycoris only thing, I certainly hope not. It just seems it would be a good way to sucker more people into using Lycoris. But I certainly hope that this is not the case.
lardman
QUOTE
This sounds cool. OZ seems to be lagging behind anyway.


As Mickey said, behind what?

Please give reasons for your conclusion.

Si
sriley
QUOTE
It just seems it would be a good way to sucker more people into using Lycoris.


It worked in my case... I just installed Lycoris on an extra box. Very different than what I'm used to, but everything seems to work. Kind of lacks that Linux-like feel. Their "Network Browser" is pretty cool, though.

QUOTE
But I certainly hope that this is not the case.


So do I.
nasteratu
Bleh, I certainly hope that it does not come to that for me I am not much a fan of Lycoris, but hey its not even out yet, I don't know why I am complaining so soon hehee.
VeeDubb
I'm a bit surprized about the name. I can't imagine that this isn't a gigantic copyright violation. I'm a anti MS as the next guy, but I just totaly fail to see how this could even be anywhere near legal.
Anonymous
QUOTE
QUOTE
This sounds cool. OZ seems to be lagging behind anyway.


As Mickey said, behind what?

Please give reasons for your conclusion.

Si


The only OZ build available for the 5600 is 3.3.5. Its README says "This particular build is probably not of any use to end users. It is inteded for testing/debug purposes". I haven't even been able to get it to install on my 5600.

From my own selfish point of view, I would say that OZ is lagging behind if it cannot be used by a significant portion of Zaurus owners.

Please not that I realize that it's ridiculous to complain about a product provided, for free, by a community of volunteers. I wish I had the skills to help get OZ working on the 5600, but I don't.

- Tom, who has yet to register and get a user name
Anonymous
That lycoris site has never worked for me? Did they pull the page or what?

And yes OZ doesnt have a fully working image that uses the newer kernel. The testing builds are worthles for any casual user.
VeeDubb
QUOTE
That lycoris site has never worked for me? Did they pull the page or what?

And yes OZ doesnt have a fully working image that uses the newer kernel. The testing builds are worthles for any casual user.



I have had the same results and my guess would be yes, they pulled it. As I said before I can't even begin to imagine how on earth this isn't a gigantic copyright violation. I just don't see how it would even be possible.

As for OZ, I agree that the testing builds have some problems, but I think calling them "worthless for any casual user" is a pretty big overstatement. 3.3.5 and 3.3.6 both installed flawlessly for me and 3.3.6 continues to work with only one major bug, (aside from thenew gcc not working with old apps).

If you don't like a particular ROM, that's fine, but let's not be slanderous either.
sriley
QUOTE
it's ridiculous to complain about a product provided, for free, by a community of volunteers.


Exactly.

That being said, I'd define casual user as someone who uses the Z but doesn't hack or develop, and to that type of user anything that doesn't perform seamlessly and flawlessly is basically worthless.
Anonymous
QUOTE
QUOTE
it's ridiculous to complain about a product provided, for free, by a community of volunteers.


Exactly.

That being said, I'd define casual user as someone who uses the Z but doesn't hack or develop, and to that type of user anything that doesn't perform seamlessly and flawlessly is basically worthless.


Like Windows? :wink:
Anonymous
can oz rotate the c7x0 screen automatically when you flip from palmtop to clamshell mode?? or do you have to run the rotate app like the preclamshell devices?
Mickeyl
That feature already works in Opie HEAD - you have to compile it yourself though, 'cause we aren't building packages until we're out of build system migration mode.
revdjenk
The Lycoris/pocketpc page is back up. It looks like release is pushed back to second quarter of 2004.

http://www.lycoris.com/products/pocketpc/index.php

Since I am not an Opie/OpenZ user, I cannot tell for sure, but is Lycoris based on it? The screenshots look similar... or is that "familiar?"
Stigger
QUOTE
QUOTE
it's ridiculous to complain about a product provided, for free, by a community of volunteers.


Exactly.

That being said, I'd define casual user as someone who uses the Z but doesn't hack or develop, and to that type of user anything that doesn't perform seamlessly and flawlessly is basically worthless.


I neither hack nor develop, but I do possess at least part of a clue stick. After reading the readme and replacing the hotplug app I have zero problems with 3.3.5/6.

I'm not sure that this qualifes as worthless
sriley
QUOTE
After reading the readme and replacing the hotplug app I have zero problems with 3.3.5/6.


Translation: At first, it didn't work. After performing the proper hack as indicated in the readme file, 3.3.5/6 works.

To clarify: In order for the majority of users to like it, it needs to work correctly when it first boots after flashing. If it doesn't, it will be useless to them.
aig
I would be interesting in knowing what connection Lycoris has with OZ/OPIE. To me it sounds like they are trying to realize commercial gains from open source community work. Is this case? Does anyone know what their contribution would be back to OZ/OPIE, if any?
VeeDubb
sriley, I think you are grossly under-estimating the average Z user. If we were talking about a PPC or Palm I would totaly agree with you, but I think very few of the people here are so stupid/ignorant/lazy that they would find a fantastic rom that kicks the krap out of basiacly every other rom (X11 on the CXXX series excepted) just because they have to actualy read the directions to make it work.

We're not talking about complicated uber-user hacks to get it working, just a few simple adjustments to the norm.
sriley
QUOTE
sriley, I think you are grossly under-estimating the average Z user.


Possibly. I doubt that most of the vocal Z users are really average at all, especially relative to all PDA/handheld users.

Reading the OSS handheld post on Slashdot makes me think that the average user probably sold his Z on Ebay within a week of purchasing it due to some trivial synch issue, and that only those of us who like to screw with things kept them.
Anonymous
QUOTE
After reading the readme and replacing the hotplug app I have zero problems with 3.3.5/6.


What readme are you talking about? the only readme I could find in any of the 860 direcetories is at http://www.openzaurus.org/official/experim...860/3.3.6-pre1/ and it doesn't describe any "hack" required.

I would love to try OZ, but I have never gotten any applications to run on it. (I've posted in the past but nothing suggested would work - apps would install but fail on startup). I've tried 3.3.5 and 3.3.6pre several times, but no go.
b2bpro
Whoops, that last post was me - gotta re-login after a few days of no posts I guess.

- b2bpro
desco
QUOTE
QUOTE
it's ridiculous to complain about a product provided, for free, by a community of volunteers.


Exactly.



Excuse me? What about it being free and made by a community of volunteers makes it excempt from criticism? That's like politicians demanding that they be excempt from criticism because their intentions were good...

This brings me back to the "What's the attraction?" thread... I feel the same way as the original poster of that thread-- especially when those of that community propose OpenZaurus as the be-all-end-all fix every time someone posts about a problem with their Sharp ROM Zaurus...

Sorry about being a come-out-of-the-shadows stalker, (although I posted quite a bit on DevNet) but this kind of elitist attitude that many open source/free/community projects have about themselves really grates on me...

-Desco-
lardman
Critisism is fine but it must be constructive. Moaning about things is not fine; if I've paid for something then I feel entitled to moan about it if it doesn't do what I want, but if I've downloaded it for free then the story is different. If people have a problem then please bring it to the attention of the developers (and those like me who try to help out) and in the fullness of time it will be addressed (because of a lack of people and the difficulty of re-creating problems too).

Saiten's original issue was why people always suggest OZ as an alternative to problems with the Sharp ROM. Basically because OZ has been developed and has addressed the orginal issues which Qtopia had. This is not to say that it's perfect, but it is developing. This brings me on to his second point about there never being a final, finished, polished stable version. This is true and it is an issue. I personally think that to get more people on board OZ (and Qtopia to tell the truth) should become more polished (though whether these people would contribute to the coding and general development is questionable), but if I could get developing I would probably be more inclined to develop new things as they are more interesting to me now. It's a catch 22, I can't really remember what I found difficult when I started using OZ so can't really know what I ought to try and make more polished. This is where constructive critisism comes in.


Si
lardman
QUOTE
Sorry about being a come-out-of-the-shadows stalker, (although I posted quite a bit on DevNet) but this kind of elitist attitude that many open source/free/community projects have about themselves really grates on me...


Don't worry, I know how you feel, though I may be suffering from a lack of patience (which I always criticise). I would like to start doing kernel development but can't grab the source as I'm using Windows, filename problems due to the lack of case-sensitivity etc. I don't seem to get much joy from the mailing list (either on where the current stuf is or on how to skirt my troubles) - they probably think I'm a time-wasting idiot, or perhaps people just don't know, it's always difficult to tell.

Thankfully I am at least reasonably motivated and so have gone to the trouble of obtaining a Linux box to install at uni so I can get the source code. Generally a pain in the arse, but still I try.


Si
sriley
QUOTE
Excuse me?  What about it being free and made by a community of volunteers makes it excempt from criticism?


Constructive criticism and complaining are two different things. For those of us who aren't developers and can't offer code or solutions, acknowledging the huge effort of the OZ team is the only way we can distinguish between the two when reporting issues.

QUOTE
That's like politicians demanding that they be excempt from criticism because their intentions were good...


No, it isn't. Politicians are paid employees with huge perks with subsequent benefits and high-level social clout. Nice try, though.
bluey
I hope they, as Mickeyl stated, contribute back with patches...

They must be charging for their icon/wallpaper set... tongue.gif
doseas
Interview with the founder of Lycoris here:
http://www.desktopos.com/sections.php?op=v...article&artid=3
dassa
Came across this today, a little more info on Lycoris Pocket PC Edition.

http://www.lycoris.org/sections.php?op=vie...ticle&artid=119

Hmmm.. things could get very interesting.
ScottYelich
QUOTE
Came across this today, a little more info on Lycoris Pocket PC Edition.

http://www.lycoris.org/sections.php?op=vie...ticle&artid=119

Hmmm.. things could get very interesting.


page comes up with (only):

Unable to select database

Scott
yzord
Here's the relevant bit:

QUOTE
Development continues on Pocket PC Edition, although it's too early to give you more screenshots yet. Pocket PC Edition won't be a copy of Desktop/LX with all the bells and whistles stripped out so that it fits on a handheld, it will be a package built from the ground up for mobile computing. We are working hand in hand with developers from handhelds.org, Opie, OpenZaurus and OpenEmbedded, and have contacts inside these existing project to make sure that we not only have solid technology in our products, but that we give back to the community that created them in the first place. All of the changes we make to the open source components of these projects will be given directly back to them, as required by the GPL. I can state that unequivocally because we will be creating those changes in tandem with them - they'll hit their CVS or BitKeeper source repositories almost immediately after hitting ours. 

In order to make sure that our products are able to integrate with the desktop version of our operating system, and with others as well, we've got solid contacts within the KDE community as well. We've donated hardware and Internet access, for example, to the developer working on Opie's sync framework and KDE's KitchenSync program to ensure that not only will Pocket PC Edition sync with Desktop/LX, but with any other KDE desktop, be it SuSE, Debian, Mandrake, or others. 

Pocket PC Edition won't be released until after the next Desktop/LX version is finished, but we want to let you know that things are moving along. We greatly appreciate all the enthusiasm we've seen over this product, and welcome your e-mails. I think I've seen more requests to beta test this software product than any other product we've announced. We hope to have something for you to look at soon. When we do, it will be a beautiful work of art, I guarantee. There will also be over a thousand software programs ready for it the day it hits the streets - games, productivity applications, gadgets, and more - thanks to the open source community, all prepackaged, all downloadable, all optimized for your handheld. 

So stock up on those Compact Flash and Secure Digital cards - you'll be able to fill dozens of them with software that you can get from Pocket PC Edition's version of the Iris Software Gallery. And it's all included for free with your copy of Desktop/LX Pocket PC Edition. 


Make of that what you will...
Yz
CoreyC
Yz, that sounds good but they also say that they are working closely with the OpenZaurus team. I think Mickey said that as far as he knows they have never been contacted.

Anything that they can contribute is great, but don't expect to see the 'thousands of apps' that they are claiming, unless they are going to mirror the software that is already available at ZSI smile.gif
treke
Both Opie and the OpenZaurus teams have been contacted by Lycoris. Nothing in particular has come out of Lycoris yet though.
lardman
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS7056225751.html

Looks like a page of screen shots of Opie to me.

Quoting the top line of said link:

QUOTE
Updated Jan. 31 -- Lycoris will ship a version of its desktop Linux operating system (OS) designed specifically for handheld devices in Q2, 2004. The OS, dubbed Desktop/LX Pocket PC Edition (DL-PPC), will provide a "commercial-ready" and user-friendly OS that Lycoris hopes to license to device designers as well as market directly to consumers.


Can a GPL OS (which OZ & Opie = Lycoris afaik is) be licensed to people?

I must admit I'm not overly impressed seeing things like "DL-PPC applications" or "DL-PPC's "today" screen", when these applications are probably actually the very same as the Opie/OZ ones (though if they have in fact been heavily modified I'll eat my words).


Simon
lardman
Ignore me, obviously old (and slightly skewed) news (I saw the 31, ignored the January :-), just that someone posted the above link in another part of the forum.

I looked at their page - as quoted above - and they do say that they are working with and giving back to OZ/Opie/etc..

It's been a long day, I'll go back to sleep I think ;-)

Si
craigtyson
One year later. Has anyone seen a commercial version of PPC Lycoris ?

If not then regardles of which ROM you use I think a big thankyou to all the developers of all Z ROMs is in order. They should be congratulated for sustaining a user base who would be forced into using PPC or PALM instead of having a linux OS which is rich, stable and constantly developing. Two years ago I bought a 5500 with SHARP's ROM on it. I couldnt play dvds, or brows the web, or run doom or write in chinese or use bluetooth or......

Today my PC hardly gets used (anyone want to buy a 400MHz AMD Mandrake PC 4GB HDD..... OK I guess not its not like you han put it in your pocket...) I am infact typing this up on a newly aquired 750 running cacko 1.22a but have run OZ and tkc both of which have shown how much effort all "our" developers have put into making the Zaurus a sucess.

Thanks guys. Im truly impressed keep up the good work.
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