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dougeeebear
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 8 2007, 09:05 PM)
Surprised to hear your choice.
Not doubting you, but just wondering if you were referring to the screen in native 800x480 or 800x600 or the 1024x600 mode?

800x480 is crystal clear and definitely has larger fonts than c1000.

Granted I got the touch-screen version ... wink.gif
*

Actually, I'm talking about the 800x480 mode.
True, the screen is awesome, but the fonts are so fine I have a hard time with it.
Of course, I'm no spring chicken any more either smile.gif

On the Zaurus, the fonts seem a bit bolder, which makes it easier for me to read.

I think if I liked the keyboard better, I might try changing the fonts to compensate, but the keyboard really sucks as far as I'm concerned and I don't feel like doing brain surgery on it to (maybe) make it better.
Da_Blitz
actually i have been thinking about giving matchbox a try on the thing as its not the fastest piece of hardware in the world. that and the fonts are a bit bigger (i hate tiny clocks)
dougeeebear
Well, after a couple days, I decided to try and experiment with the keyboard a little bit.
I gathered up all Kopsis' info on remapping the keys, and got up the courage to try and remove a couple of the keycaps.
I was successful at removing two of them without removing the keyboard by just prying up on them with my fingernails.
After the first two I think I might be able to change them successfully.
I'm not sure if I'm going for the hairbrush trick or not though.
I have a keyboard coming that I ordered on ebay.
I'm also going to play around with the fonts and see what I come up with there.

Doug
Da_Blitz
after reading up a bit on teh keycap problem i noticed that some people say that even after the mod the keys are not perfect

so bieng an egineer i look into it a bit futher,

the problem i see with teh hairbrush idea is that if you push it off center thenthe hair brush bristle also gets of center, the way to avoid this is to attach the hair brush bristle to the rubber itself so its always in the center and glue it there

then sharpen the top to a point that fits in the "cup" (at first i would have said a ball for the top but i relise just how hard that would be)

put button back in with point in cup and the force applied should now "in thery" be more along the verticle giving better button pushes

dont know if anyone thinks the effort is worth doing it but you can cheat by using pins rather than hair brisles if you have side cutters and a file, just make sure you take the point off or your fingers may be bleeding in a couple of months

anyway thats how i will be doing it, lets just say there was way too much caffine involved in teh creation of tihs idea
dougeeebear
QUOTE(Da_Blitz @ Jun 10 2007, 12:40 PM)
after reading up a bit on teh keycap problem i noticed that some people say that even after the mod the keys are not perfect

so bieng an egineer i look into it a bit futher,

the problem i see with teh hairbrush idea is that if you push it off center thenthe hair brush bristle also gets of center, the way to avoid this is to attach the hair brush bristle to the rubber itself so its always in the center and glue it there

then sharpen the top to a point that fits in the "cup" (at first i would have said a ball for the top but i relise just how hard that would be)

put button back in with point in cup and the force applied should now "in thery" be more along the verticle giving better button pushes

dont know if anyone thinks the effort is worth doing it but you can cheat by using pins rather than hair brisles if you have side cutters and a file, just make sure you take the point off or your fingers may be bleeding in a couple of months

anyway thats how i will be doing it, lets just say there was way too much caffine involved in teh creation of tihs idea
*

I think I'll just change the keycaps to start with, and maybe sometime at a later point, I'll mess around with a touchy/feely trick.
kopsis
QUOTE(Da_Blitz @ Jun 10 2007, 12:40 PM)
after reading up a bit on teh keycap problem i noticed that some people say that even after the mod the keys are not perfect
*


True, but the improvement is pretty dramatic. As one of my mentors used to say: "anyone can strive for perfection, but only the best engineers know how to stop at good enough." smile.gif

Your idea sounds like it will work, but it's going to be a lot of extra work for that last fraction of a percent. Given that the hairbrush mod is totally reversable (as long as you don't glue the bristles in), you may want to try it first on a few keys and see what you think.
dougeeebear
Kopsis,
I just did a system backup, then installed your keyboard remapping files and edited the registry to check it out.
The keys are all perfect, except for the following:

The Alt and Windows keys are still working in their original position, as opposed to their being shown reversed in your final result photo.
Also, it appears the new F9 and F10 keys are cosmetic only, as they retained their original key mapping.

This is not a problem, I just thought I would mention it.

Thanks for the tutorial,
Doug
kopsis
QUOTE(dougeeebear @ Jun 10 2007, 08:54 PM)
The keys are all perfect, except for the following:

The Alt and Windows keys are still working in their original position, as opposed to their being shown reversed in your final result photo.


Oops ... should have mentioned that in the article. They were not meant to be moved from their original positions. I accidentally swapped them when reassembling and didn't realize it until after I had taken the photos smile.gif

QUOTE
Also, it appears the new F9 and F10 keys are cosmetic only, as they retained their original key mapping.


Yeah, I may map F9 and F10 (or maybe something else) to them eventually, so I stuck them on the KB "for future use".
Da_Blitz
thought about my mod a bit more and using the non pointy end should mean you dont have to glue it, glue would help but its my experince that glue + silicon is asking for trouble

basically you have the head on teh silicon and the smaller end (sharpended a bit) in the keycap

cant wait to try it,i would compare it to the hair brush butthe keyboards i bought off ebay dont seem to have any problems at all
dougeeebear
QUOTE(kopsis @ Jun 10 2007, 09:44 PM)
Oops ... should have mentioned that in the article. They were not meant to be moved from their original positions. I accidentally swapped them when reassembling and didn't realize it until after I had taken the photos smile.gif

<snip>

Yeah, I may map F9 and F10 (or maybe something else) to them eventually, so I stuck them on the KB "for future use".
*

Whew ... that's a relief, I thought I had done something wrong.
I might have to get that Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator and mess around with it.
I'm also going to have to try and figure out those registry entries for remapping keys.

Regards,
Doug
fpp
Do try the free Key Tweak utility, much easier than either !
I remapped most of the japanese keys on my SA1 to useful ones, with a couple to spare...
dougeeebear
QUOTE(fpp @ Jun 11 2007, 01:10 PM)
Do try the free Key Tweak utility, much easier than either !
I remapped most of the japanese keys on my SA1 to useful ones, with a couple to spare...
*

Will it also change existing Japenese keys, such as:
CODE
"      +      *
2      ;      :


--to-- the English versions

CODE
@      :      *
2      ;      8

... etc ...

Or will it just remap a complete key as it is in it's current state?
fpp
As I understand it, Key Tweak deals with scan codes, ie it remaps an entire key to another. Individual values for the scan code can then be adjusted with MSKLC or a similar utility.
dougeeebear
I saw the Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator, but I don't want to install the .NET Framework.
kopsis
KeyTweak is is a "user interface" for modifying the "Keyboard Layout\Scancode Map" registry key. I had some problems with it mapping some of the "extended" keys, but once I understood what it's doing (and knew the scancodes for the various keys), it was pretty easy to modify the registry by hand to accomplish what I wanted.

KeyTweak lets you substitute one scancode for another but it won't let you change how a scancode is interpreted. For that you need Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator (MKLC). Yeah, the .NET requirement is annoying ... that's why I keep a "throw-away" Win2K VMWare virtual machine on one of my Linux boxes. Take a snapshot, install a bunch of bloated stuff, use it, when I don't need it any more I roll back to the snapshot smile.gif
dougeeebear
QUOTE(kopsis @ Jun 11 2007, 04:24 PM)
KeyTweak is is a "user interface" for modifying the "Keyboard Layout\Scancode Map" registry key. I had some problems with it mapping some of the "extended" keys, but once I understood what it's doing (and knew the scancodes for the various keys), it was pretty easy to modify the registry by hand to accomplish what I wanted.

KeyTweak lets you substitute one scancode for another but it won't let you change how a scancode is interpreted. For that you need Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator (MKLC). Yeah, the .NET requirement is annoying ... that's why I keep a "throw-away" Win2K VMWare virtual machine on one of my Linux boxes. Take a snapshot, install a bunch of bloated stuff, use it, when I don't need it any more I roll back to the snapshot smile.gif
*

I have an evaluation copy of PowerShadow.
Thanks for the idea.
Capn_Fish
It appears new Kohjinshas are coming out:

http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/13/kohjins...100-and-dmb-tv/
Snappy
QUOTE(Capn_Fish @ Jun 14 2007, 10:05 PM)
It appears new Kohjinshas are coming out:

http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/13/kohjins...100-and-dmb-tv/
*


Yeah ... saw that and was like thinking ...
1) That's a forward thinking company who trumps themselves with a quick turn-around-time for new designs,
2) Why did I have to get the 1st gen ... the curve edges look kinda groovy (may be a bit too applish to some) though the 1st gen has some character in them,
3) That is one funky antennae there ... will it snap out,
4) I'm still glad I got the 1st gen and I'm pretty happy with it, though handwriting support could be better.

So, I promise to myself, I will use this 1st gen Kohjinsha Origami (I still like Origami over UMPC) until at least 2 ~ 3 years later. smile.gif

Also, I may need to find a new owner for some of the other gadgets soon, since it is working out real nice.

If someone can answer the ubuntu or pdaXrom on Kohjinsha question on the other thread, it would be great! smile.gif
adf
the new K looks really nice, and so does the via nano reference design mentioned in the article. I'd be interested in one of these if they ran linux --and i mean fully, not mostly, or in progress. If it doesn't support linux (and it is a computer of some sort)i won't pay for it, however cool it might be.
The Asus eepc (also mentioned) seems more like what I'm looking for, or an OLPC
fpp
I'm not sure I like the rounded shapes, looks more like a toy, and seems much thicker from the pictures too. I have no need for the TV and the stupid antenna either... but maybe the keyboard has improved ? :-)
tg
Way too much waisted space around screen - also probably as a result of that resolution is only 1042x600.
But I still like the fact they are coming out with version 2 so soon.
dougeeebear
Well, the keyboard arrived today for my Kohjinsha.
The only problem is, the seller sent a substitute make/model, and the keys are made differently.
Now I have to deal with an ebay seller selling merchandise from Hong Kong.
Probably $20.54 down the drain.
Just my !@#$% luck!!!!
kopsis
QUOTE(dougeeebear @ Jun 18 2007, 03:35 PM)
Well, the keyboard arrived today for my Kohjinsha.
The only problem is, the seller sent a substitute make/model, and the keys are made differently.
*


Ouch! I hope that wasn't the same seller I recommended in my article. If it was, let me know so I can add a warning.
dougeeebear
QUOTE(kopsis @ Jun 18 2007, 04:54 PM)
QUOTE(dougeeebear @ Jun 18 2007, 03:35 PM)
Well, the keyboard arrived today for my Kohjinsha.
The only problem is, the seller sent a substitute make/model, and the keys are made differently.
*


Ouch! I hope that wasn't the same seller I recommended in my article. If it was, let me know so I can add a warning.
*


It doesn't look like it.
This is the ebay page I ordered it from.
If you scroll down the page, you'll see the item number KB-8571.
The item I received has the same looking keys until I pulled one of them off and the underside of the keycap was made totally different.
The keyboard I received is a Cross Mark model 59373003888 according to a white label stuck on the outside of the blister pack. On the card inside the blister pack is the number 2366 with no mfgr name.
That item sale was ended right after I placed my order with a quantity of 85 still available, and the pictures have been removed from the page.
I'll see what this guy will do for me, and then take it from there.
dougeeebear
I have had correspondence with the seller of the keyboard.
He wants me to provide pictures of what I received so he can help me.
At the moment it's looking positive.
With 17217 ebay ratings since Dec-30-03 and 99.5% positive feedback, I think he will do what he can to take care of me.
It's not my intention to give the seller negative feedback just because I was upset at the time.
I'll let it play out and see how it turns out.
I'll keep you posted.
dougeeebear
Here's the scoop regarding my keyboard:
The seller only has the type he sent me.
He said he will refund my money if I return it to him at my expense.
It would cost over half what I paid for it to send it back to China.
All I can say at this point is this:
Buyers beware ... the item you see may not be the item you receive.
Be prepared to expect a substitute.
Ask questions first, and buy later.

This is the keyboard I actually received.

Doug
speculatrix
in UK/Europe that would be illegal to supply the wrong goods and then to not pay the return fee - under the "distance selling directive".

unfortunately when the seller is not in the UK you've very little recourse. Your only chance is to force a full refund from paypal, but I believe they will not recover delivery charges (I had this one when I bought something listed as new and it wasn't, had to pay GBP10 to have it professionally assessed to prove it was used, and ended up only being refunded the cost of the item by paypal, worse, the seller didn't have sufficient funds anyway to cover the refund).

so, basically, on ebay, if the seller is unreliable you're screwed.
kopsis
QUOTE(dougeeebear @ Jun 22 2007, 06:21 AM)
He said he will refund my money if I return it to him at my expense.
It would cost over half what I paid for it to send it back to China.
*


That's really unfortunate. Who would have thought there are actually multiple OEMs making keyboards in this form factor?!

But I have to say that I am curious about the "feel" and accuracy of this different model. Have you tried it out using the USB port? How does it compare to the SA1's keyboard? It looks like it's about the same size so an entire keyboard transplant may be theoretically possible.
moi
QUOTE(dougeeebear @ Jun 22 2007, 01:21 PM)
Here's the scoop regarding my keyboard:
The seller only has the type he sent me.
He said he will refund my money if I return it to him at my expense.
It would cost over half what I paid for it to send it back to China.
All I can say at this point is this:
Buyers beware ... the item you see may not be the item you receive.
Be prepared to expect a substitute.
Ask questions first, and buy later.


if you paid using paypal then you can fill one of their forms asking for the refund of the money you paid because you received a different product than the one you paid for. Even if the seller signed off ebay, this will work (it worked for me once, two weeks ago, same problem). Give it a try, and good luck.
Snappy
I had a no-show for something from ebay, via paypal as well. A few emails and days later, paypal refunded me in full.

Delivery charges when the item was sent, are usually non-refundable, though some sellers will absorb the return shipment for problematic goods.
Snappy
btw, is it just me, or is there a wave of zaurus sellers? I sense that this is in anticipation of or a response to the whole series of kohjinsha and sub-lite notebook that is going for cheap.

One thing I do on my zaurus akita that I don't do on my kohjinsha is to write my diary or journal before I sleep at night; sure the korigami is very small and light for a tabletpc or notebook, but still a bundle to hold and prop up while typing in bed. With my Z, I can thumb away laying in bed and it's quite ok.

How are you guys using your Kohjinsha?
speculatrix
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 23 2007, 09:21 AM)
btw, is it just me, or is there a wave of zaurus sellers? I sense that this is in


there are quite a few C1000s being sold in the UK too; I am wondering if people are upgrading to 3200s in the anticipation of them disappearing.
kopsis
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 23 2007, 03:21 AM)
How are you guys using your Kohjinsha?
*


My real Zaurus replacement is my Nokia E61. I've found there is a lot of value in having a pocketable device with a full keyboard and good app support (i.e. a decent OS). The Z sort of filled that role, but the lack of built in voice and data connectivity (WiFi needs a fragile card sticking out the side and I still had to carry a phone for voice) eventually got too annoying for me.

My Kohjinsha picks up nicely where the E61 starts hitting its limits. Web browsing, music/movies, software development, and working with documents. Some of these (music/movies) I used to do on the Z, but for the others I had to either carry a big bag of Z accessories (portable keyboard and such) or a full laptop.

So the Kohjinsha has allowed me to go from phone+Zaurus+laptop to smartphone+Kohjinsha. So far I'm pretty happy with how this new arrangement is working out smile.gif
cycle_55
How are you guys using your Kohjinsha?
*

[/quote]

I am using mine mostly like you do, I use my Z to write articles and take notes during the day as things pop into my head. The K is used for everything else and I still have a small office where I have a desktop which does all the intensive stuff I do such as downloading. I am still looking for an appropriate phone.

cycle_55
dougeeebear
QUOTE(kopsis @ Jun 22 2007, 06:43 AM)
I am curious about the "feel" and accuracy of this different model. Have you tried it out using the USB port? How does it compare to the SA1's keyboard? It looks like it's about the same size so an entire keyboard transplant may be theoretically possible.
*
The feel and accuracy are somewhat better than the SA1 ... it doesn't seem to miss keystrokes, however there is still a little play in the keys (nothing serious).
The opening for the keyboard on the Kohjinsha is about 1/32" more in both length and width than on the USB keyboard.
As far as a "transplant", I havent a clue, but I think it would be a big improvement if it could be done.

It does work very nicely as a USB keyboard on the K ... using the English(United States) language option, all the keys work as displayed on the keyboard.

All in all, it's a nice working little keyboard and I've decided I'm going to keep it.
For $20 it's not worth the hassle of going around with the seller about it.
ericyy
Official info for the new Kohjinsha:

http://www.kohjinsha.com/models/sh/sh6wb04a/index.html
Snappy
So is it correct to say that for tabletPCs or Kohjinshas running MS Vista, it would be considered tablet enabled? ie, there is no Vista TabletPC edition right? Vista has handwriting natively built in right?
ArchiMark
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 28 2007, 08:27 AM)
So is it correct to say that for tabletPCs or Kohjinshas running MS Vista, it would be considered tablet enabled? ie, there is no Vista TabletPC edition right? Vista has handwriting natively built in right?
*


I think all Vista editions EXCEPT for Vista Home Basic have the tablet PC functionality built-in.....

HTH...
Snappy
QUOTE(ArchiMark @ Jun 29 2007, 01:17 AM)
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 28 2007, 08:27 AM)
So is it correct to say that for tabletPCs or Kohjinshas running MS Vista, it would be considered tablet enabled? ie, there is no Vista TabletPC edition right? Vista has handwriting natively built in right?
*


I think all Vista editions EXCEPT for Vista Home Basic have the tablet PC functionality built-in.....

HTH...
*



*ouch* ... MS is beginning to get on me with all their 'flavors' of Vista ... becoming a joke!
Snappy
QUOTE(kopsis @ Jun 23 2007, 09:48 PM)
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 23 2007, 03:21 AM)
How are you guys using your Kohjinsha?
*


My real Zaurus replacement is my Nokia E61. I've found there is a lot of value in having a pocketable device with a full keyboard and good app support (i.e. a decent OS). The Z sort of filled that role, but the lack of built in voice and data connectivity (WiFi needs a fragile card sticking out the side and I still had to carry a phone for voice) eventually got too annoying for me.

My Kohjinsha picks up nicely where the E61 starts hitting its limits. Web browsing, music/movies, software development, and working with documents. Some of these (music/movies) I used to do on the Z, but for the others I had to either carry a big bag of Z accessories (portable keyboard and such) or a full laptop.

So the Kohjinsha has allowed me to go from phone+Zaurus+laptop to smartphone+Kohjinsha. So far I'm pretty happy with how this new arrangement is working out smile.gif
*



Aye ... That's true for me as well ... although the Kohjinsha is bigger and heavier, it has more things built in, and so I end up with lesser things to bring but still have equal if not more functionality than carrying the Z with the accessories.
Snappy
QUOTE(cycle_55 @ Jun 23 2007, 11:42 PM)
I am using mine mostly like you do, I use my Z to write articles and take notes during the day as things pop into my head. The K is used for everything else and I still have a small office where I have a desktop which does all the intensive stuff I do such as downloading. I am still looking for an appropriate phone.

cycle_55
*


Aye ... the kohjinsha is really beginning to sink into me, or me into it. It is still too heavy to lay down on one's back and read or surf with it, no matter which way I turn, but it is truly meeting most if not all my other needs. wink.gif
zodttd
Can someone write up a quick table of these new handhelds emerging including a possible street price? It would be amazingly helpful! Especially with new ones like the Asus Eee, Kohjinsha, Via's UMPC. It get's very confusing also to know what's currently available and release dates. So much info! tongue.gif

Hope that the request isn't an annoying one.
Snappy
QUOTE(zodttd @ Jun 29 2007, 12:54 PM)
Can someone write up a quick table of these new handhelds emerging including a possible street price? It would be amazingly helpful! Especially with new ones like the Asus Eee, Kohjinsha, Via's UMPC. It get's very confusing also to know what's currently available and release dates. So much info! tongue.gif

Hope that the request isn't an annoying one.
*


No worries, it's not much of a hassle ... especially when these info is easily found in some of the umpc sites. wink.gif

In any case, AFAIK, only Kohjinsha is out in the market, on the shelf, below the bed, in the toilet, ... you get the idea? biggrin.gif

Kohjinsha - ~ US$680 to US$780 depending on model. Available in Singapore, US (via parallel importers like conics, dynamism etc)
Asus Eee -
Via's UMPC -

ok, here's a better idea ... tongue.gif ... Prices are on individual pages...
http://www.umpcportal.com/products/
zodttd
Thanks Snappy! Never knew about umpcportal!
The Kohjinsha sounds cool, but may be considered pricey depending how the Asus Eee does when it arrives.

I liked the looks of the Pepper Pad on there. It looks like a gaming PocketPC. tongue.gif
speculatrix
thought people might be interested in a video review of the nanobook aka packard bell XS; this looks like a real rival to the Asus eee - depending on price, cheaper by far than the Fuj U8420/U1010 but less sexy!

http://www.ultramobilelife.com/index.php?o...ask=view&id=340
tg
Konjinsha SH8 announced.

http://www.umpcportal.com/modules/news/art...php?storyid=856
speculatrix
QUOTE(tg @ Sep 4 2007, 05:34 PM)


looks very nice, and not massively expensive; it'd be nice if the TV tuner module could be swapped for a DVB-T module so it'd work here in the UK!

I note that the vye website pdf on it has an image stolen from Akihabaranews - see the green space pig in the background?
emikwhe
QUOTE(Snappy @ Jun 23 2007, 12:21 AM) *
btw, is it just me, or is there a wave of zaurus sellers? I sense that this is in anticipation of or a response to the whole series of kohjinsha and sub-lite notebook that is going for cheap.

One thing I do on my zaurus akita that I don't do on my kohjinsha is to write my diary or journal before I sleep at night; sure the korigami is very small and light for a tabletpc or notebook, but still a bundle to hold and prop up while typing in bed. With my Z, I can thumb away laying in bed and it's quite ok.

How are you guys using your Kohjinsha?

I invested in a Kohjinsha SH6 just before the announcement of the SH8 but have been extremely impressed. Couldnt wait to get rid of the Vista, and now running Fedora 7 which was an easy install even to get the integral wireless working with the rt73 serialmonkey driver, and touchscreen with the PenMount 6000 Driver.

Still use Zaurus with PdaxII13 but use Notecase on both Zaurus and the Kohjinsha for capturing meeting notes. The Kohjinsha has effectively replaced my work laptop as far easier to lug around for presentations, but the Zaurus remains an invaluable work tool for on the fly notes in confined spaces such as trains etc. It is an excellent combination of mobile tools especially as no Windows needed.

The only gripe is the battery life, should have gone for the high capacity battery. Seriously considering replacing the internal hard disk with a more power friendly option as did not go for the SSD version. Have already had the Kohjinsha completely apart as accidently triggured the BIOS password like a total idiot, and had to remove the battery on the Motherboard to reset the BIOS. Luckily there are a few good articles on the web that give advice on this nerve racking experience. Not sure what the best option would be for the disk replacement at this stage, but getting access to the drive is not that difficult

Mike
speculatrix
QUOTE(emikwhe @ Oct 8 2007, 07:33 PM) *
Couldnt wait to get rid of the Vista


you do know, dontcha, that if you can get a free downgrade to XP pro from Vista business? install XP (need some random installation disk), then ring up MS's activation hotline when it want's to validate, quote the product key for vista you have and they'll give you the activation code.

we just bought some laptops at work with Vista, and I'll be downgrading them before they get used.
dougeeebear
I'm just curious if the SH8 keyboard would fit and work on my SA1.
It has two shift keys (really needed) and the F1-F12 keys are all straight across the top.
Plus they say the SH8 keyboard is much improved from the original one.
If I thought I could get it to work, I might try and order just the keyboard.

Doug
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