I did the upgrade by simply changing "etch" to "lenny", and adding "contrib" and "non-free", so the lines becomes:

How does "lenny" different from "testing", or are they just they same?

Debian newbies & friends, check out these valuable resources:

http://qref.sourceforge.net/
http://www.debian.org/doc/

I'm not sure it will happen to everyone or not. When I installed at first, I told it to do a "desktop" install -- it was aiming at a full debian archive, and gave me a full desktop, with gnome, xorg, and more than I could hold. If you just do your initial install from the business card installation, then do the titchy thing, you may only get the kdrive server.

But, if you do have this problem, then all that happens is that your X symlink will be pointing to the wrong place. AFAIR all you do is check where the /etc/X11/X symlink points. It should point to /opt/kdrive/X, which is just a script setting the library path and starting the Xfbdev server. That came from the titchy site.

I haven't fiddled with bluetooth, nor with media. I haven't tried plugging anything in to iceweasel -- certainly flash won't work, since that is x86 only (I have the same problem on my 64-bit office machine).

Two fancy trivias:

Try this Debian quiz. It's fun. http://www.df7cb.de/debian/quiz/
(For example, what is the correct pronunciation of "Debian"?)

"The code names of Debian releases are names of characters from the movie Toy Story." (from Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian )

I asked him about that, since removing Sylpheed warned that it would remove titchy. But titchy and titchy-network (or whatever it was) are just meta-packages he set up to get what he thought was a resonable base -- and that included Sylpheed and gaim.

I removed them, and my titchy desktop and all that is still there. don't worry about those.

My biggest problem was removing all the gnome stuff, once it installed. That is a hugh cluster-f of files, and there is no nice way to remove it. It's done now, though, except what I need to run gnumeric.

I did not see this error, and can't figure what it would be. Sounds like a problem with your microdrive. Titchy by default formats the whole thing as one big partition. Not my idea of the right thing to do. I had to fight it to let me re-formal so I had separte /home and /var partitions, along with swap space.

After this failure, can you boot in using the rescue boot (our own three-fingered salute) and see what the drive looks like? It should be one large ext2 (or 3) partition. If it is not formatted properly, maybe you could format from the rescue boot and comment out that part of the script. Be sure to give plenty of room for the distribution. Ihave 1.5G for it, plus /usr/share/doc and /var are re-located to other partitions.

It is certainly as "fast" as pdaXrom, and has the advantage of working....

Hey, pdaXrom works! Perhaps it is not as polished, but it does work!

that is my suspicion-- that the auto formatting in the script isn't handling my drive.I have replaced the original MD with a 16GB CF, which has worked just fine for pdax.
The problem is that I reformatted the "drive" using the emergency system and then got the same result, and have no idea how to make the debian installer NOT format my drive.

the drive is getting formatted as 1 big partition--and that might be the problem.possib
Are there any partition requirements,like boot flags or anything of the kind?

incidentally, I can't find anything other than "clear the hd in the diag menus

What I'd like to do, but lack the knowledge, is format the drive manually, and see if it goes. how can that be done without reflashing several times?.

That is my suspicion-- that the auto formatting in the script isn't handling my drive.I have replaced the original MD with a 16GB CF, which has worked just fine for pdax.
The problem is that I reformatted the "drive" using the emergency system and then got the same result, and have no idea how to make the debian installer NOT format my drive.

the drive is getting formatted as 1 big partition--I don't know if it is really being formatted, though--I just know the partition gets changed. Could it be a failure to format?

could it be that the image I'm extracting is flawed? ( I downloaded twice)
Are there any partition requirements,like boot flags or anything of the kind?

incidentally, I can't find anything other than "clear the hd in the diag menus

What I'd like to do, but lack the knowledge, is format the drive manually, and see if it goes. how can that be done without reflashing several times?.

I'll flash a basic pdax on, and check the drive and see about editing the script--then I'll try again

Ok--checked the hd--1 big ext3 . how do i edit the update.sh to comment out the format command? once that is accomplished I think this can be made to work

I've just posted a simple benchmarking report (Sandisk Extreme III CF 16gb vs. Hitachi microdrive 6gb) using apdarm here:
http://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showt...93&#entry167593

And here are more rough speed test results under Lenny (1st launch, subsequent launch):


@adf: Have you tried another SD card? I also ran into problem with extracting the CD image to one of my SD cards (which has been abused severely).

I haven't yet.
Hopefully I can get info on how to avoid the auto formatting before I try again. My problem, though seems to be that the boot loader doesn't recognize my 16G cf.
I suspect that this is either a problem with the card--which seems unlikley as it has been working perfectly,or a problem with the formatting, or possibly a problem with the debian hw support extraction from my sd to my hd.

what I hope to try:
prevent auto format in updater (don't know how)
repartition and format my sd, try another sd and a fresh dl (can't do til later this evening)
replace the 16G CF with a 6G MD (would rather not)

What else might help?

When the setup asks for what set of packages to install (laptop, standard, server, multimedia, etc.), which, if any, are necessary/recommended to select?

Just choose "standard".

OK, thanks.

EDIT: Hmm...It seems to be frozen trying to download the packages. Is there a way to restart just that step without doing the whole install again?

EDIT2: Never mind...Just wait for it to time out

the problem is that the manid of your cards needs to be compiled into the kernel in order for it to boot off it and since your card is not standard to the Zaurus it most likely did not get included during compilation of the kernel. you just need to recompile the kernel with your card's manfid added

That would explain why the card id is blank in the emergency menu too, wouldn't it (the emergency systenm kernel wouldn't have much by way of extra device info)?

SO.. that raises 2 questions and 2 possible outcomes

1a How do I get the manufacturer's ID without pulling the card?
it is an A-DATA 16GB Compact Flash Model SPEEDY CF 16GB 40x

1b How do I compile this kernel with support for this drive? or is anyone else inclined to do so?

2a possibly I will have to swap out the card for a 6GB microdrive to run titichy?

2b Or I just don't run titchy.

hmmm. I'd really prefer to keep the card in, and I'd like to give titchy a whirl.

They are the same -- for now. Etch used to be testing, until it was released as the new stable. Now, lenny is testing. "unstable" is always named sid, after the kid in Toy Story who broke everyone's toys.

To get the installer to not format, I would try to edit the installer script. I haven't done so, but it ought to be possible.

If you, you could send that 16g drive to me for extensive testing.

I was able to re-format the drive my way, using the debian installer that appeared during the installation. But if it barfs before it gets that far, you may be forced to fiddle with the installation script.

Or, you could ask Neil, who I imagine is about to get inundated with questions.

I don't want to denigrate either pdaXrom or Angstrom. pdaXrom was a big jump from OE for me. But it was a friggin' nightmare to try to upgrade from beta 1 to the 098 (or whatever it is/was). I could not do it. I semi-bricked my toy twice in trying, for a whole day. Angstrom then came to the rescue, and it's installation and stability are great. But that project is so focused on development and extension to various machines that the user, the guy like me who wants to install what he needs and go, is left with too many packages that are just broken, and never get fixed. Tex, firefox, lyx, wifi-radar, and many other mission-critical packages for me were broken when I first installed, were well-known to be broken, and are at the same stage they were in March. Can you print from Angstrom? Use bluetooth? Just a second. I have a bluetooth card here I couldn't use in either Angstrom or pdaXrom. Let's see. OK, some setback, but I don't know what modules to load for my Belkin F8T020 adapter.

The bright idea of titchy is to just concentrate on getting a working kernel (which do exist, all ready to go), basic utils and config, and an X server --- just for one or two machines, too, and then set it up to use the largest "feed" (distribution) available. Makes sense to me. You don't have to bust your balls trying to "port" firefox or tex, either of which would be a monumental task. They are already there, tested by thousands of users.

Of course, my attitude is helped by the fact that I've used debian for years and years.

I get "Temporary failure resolving 'debian.neilandtheresa.co.uk' when doing an apt-get update. How should I fix this? I can't ping it either, or anything (except my router, everything else says "ubknown host xyz"). Suggestions?

you should fix you router/replace it, or change to use static ip addresses instead of dhcp since your leases do not automatically renew themselves effectively....

i agree with all you have said. but the kernel imho is still missing a few important features. once those are added/fixed then it would be almost perfect except for the speed which hopefully switching to the armel feed should fix once it has been fully ported.

I am currently using a static IP address. Given that, is there anything I can do outside of fiddling with my router? It worked mostly fine in pdaXrom.

EDIT: Using dhcp fixed it.

I can certainly agree that the kernel is missing at least one important feature--it doesn't recognize my internal CF

I think meanie was right about the kernel not recognizing my internal CF. I guess I'll wait for an update to both the kernel and the installer...

that means your static ip settings were wrong. could have been netmask, route or dns settings...

Let me add some detail also for those struggling with the installer.
It is the best to install Debian via a mirror.
Dhcp does not work during installation.
The first time you try to set up your network card is bound to fail. At most you can enter your Z's IP address and WEP key, but it seems the installation forces dhcp, which is broken at this stage.



So you're gonna see an error while the system is trying to run DHCP.
So as soon as you get out of the network setup step, you will enter the main installation menu.
Choose "Detect network hardware" as shown in the picture:




After the network card is recognized, go to "Configure the network". This time you can choose NOT to have the installer looked for a dynamic IP (dhcp). Say "No" and you can manually enter a static IP, (of course you gotta set up the card's IP in your router first), together with Netmask, Router's IP, and DNS



The network card is set up successfully if no error pops up.

You can do the network setup either before or after formatting the HDD (again first detect the disk, then partition the entire space in one big partition using the "Guided" mode -- they are all found in the installer menu.)

Sooner or later you may encounter the annoying "Fail to load the codename" message. If you are the lucky one then go up in the installer menu and choose "Load installer component from CD".
Pick the "choose-mirror" component (using [Space] key). You may also get SSH client and rescue mode. But don't fiddle with others. I got into trouble the first time when I greedily took everything.



Then in the installer menu you'll see a new option enabling you to choose a Debian mirror. Go there and pick "Stable" when you're given the choice of versions. This will install the base system.

Next is the software set. Go for the "standard" installation (i.e. not "laptop" and the others).



Just follow the path and you will be there. Good luck, everybody!

Sorry for the poor quality of the pics. Actually I was thinking of preparing an installation walkthrough ...

yeah yeah..for those of us with supported drives

It's tempting to hijack the topic, but I posted my reply in another dedicated thread:
http://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showt...28&#entry167628

It great to see APM work well in Debian. Suspend/resume and battery level have no issue so far.

Now: how to adjust backlight in Debian/XFCE4? I've searched for a while but have yet to bump into a solution.

I was tempted by the comments and tried it. Back to Cacko at the moment.

Questions: (I'll also comment at TitchyLinux Wiki)

1. The failures all seem to relate to 'identifying' and using the disk. 6GB in my 3200, any suggestions as to which driver to pick when offered the choice?

2. I was using a PEAK 1GB SD card, might there be a problem with that? Will try a different card.

3. Given the mirror installation choice, picked http, does anyone have a 'good' UK choice?

4. Wireless networking seemed to work fine if I set static info. Would it work if I tried to install with my CF lan card as the network access? I often find the wireless link problematic on the Zs.

This seems very promising as it is a disk based 'traditional linux set up.

Cheers for now.

To answer my own question: seems to be that the 128MB SD card I'm using now has let the install proceed normally.

Of course I did do new downloads for all the files, so that might have something to do with it. The SD card change is favourite though, someone posted a comment at Titchy that using a 128 MB instead of a 1GB card sorted them out.

Watching the mirror downloading now, my much distrusted wireless link is behaving extremely well!

No doubt there'll be more later! (At least I can restore the hard drive if I have to after yesterday's little escapade. I'm off to shred spam in the Wiki.

Actually the first broken card I mentioned before is a 1GB Apacer SD (nude even without any label or sticker on it). The CD image failed to extract properly on this card. Then I switched to a Kingston 256MB SD and everything went well.
@adf: Perhaps you can give your other SDs a chance. That may work.

Yes, the Debian installation process is quite fun in itself. I had never imagined that would be possible when I got my first Z!
Hardware-wise the basic things (like suspend/resume, shutdown, system clock, etc) seem to be working well out of the box. Package-wise I can't say enough how good it is.

Looking forward to your hands-on report.

I'm trying it also and it looks awesome. Just some problems at certain step of installation related to SD card (1 GB) and some weird wifi problems with my CF card (I don't know why but it work randomly in the instalation process, especially after first reboot).

Now, lets play a little with apps to see what can we make with this little.

Try http://mirror.ox.ac.uk/debian/

Plenty of bandwidth here!!

Cheers,

Alistair

Me too... My int CF is not a popular one, and I've got exactly the same issue as yous. Thinking about replacing it with a sandisk.

Maybe there is another way of installing like doing a NAND backuo/restore and copying the data directly to the CF in another linux machine...

Well, if only our internal CF can be recognized and mounted by the debian kernel

tux seems to be hinting that the CF recognition issue may have to do with the failure of the SD card to properly handle the CD installation image. My 1gb SD also failed.
[Well, I suddenly remember that the same 1gb SD card failed to install Debian EABI too!]
So, perhaps ...
-- try a different and smaller SD
-- restore the CF to its original partition state as descibed in Meanie's website, and just let the Debian installer reformat & repartition it?

Maybe someone can ask "neil" to change the installer to make the installer skip the initial formatting of the microdrive and ask where debian has to be installed to.
I can see a way here to be able to install it on a C1000 (or even C7x0) : put install files on the first partition of a 4Gb-SD, install debian to the second partition.
Not sure there is support for +1Gb SD cards.

Only thinking out loud ...
Chero.

Tried 4 different brand SD (though all 1G). Even tried deleting all partition in emergency mode and let the installer do the job, still no joy. A bit discouraged

EDIT: now gathering all SD from different dc and try them one by one. Hope I still have a <1G one

I'm now looking at a little rat as the gui snaps into action.

I am convinced that the problems I had yesterday were to do with that old 'Will this SD card work for flashing?' question! Nice to see that some things don't change!

I still had some wobbles as it installed though. All down to me reading too hastily.

Now all I have to do is find out how to use the gui!!

Thanks Urkden for the post over at TitchyLinux, gave me the urge to try with one of my old, smaller cards.

Thanks for your suggestion, but this time I just took the first one in the suggested list for the UK and it worked!

Hi ZDevil.

I'm sure that this is the difference. This time around the loading of the base packages that do the hardware detection etc. went all the way through. The first attempts bottled out at low percentages as I watched the progress bar.

This time the hard disk was detected and the parted came into action.

I forgot the name of the option on the main menu, but I looked at ZDevil's screenshots and it is the 'load installer components' one.

This is looking very good.

I had an install issue as well with a 1Gb SD. This solved it :

Create new partitions using fdisk, create at least two, set the type of the first one to fat (type 6), save the partition table, format the first partition using mkfs.msdos, copy the files to this partition and play.

The trouble with some preformatted and pre-partitioned SD's is that the installer/emergency system/nand-restore ... doesn't recognise the partitions, even though they are just fine for normal use. Repartitioning on a linux box or the zaurus usually solves the problem.
I've done this trick several times to restore nand, install uboot and I had to do it again to install titchy.

Second tip : wait long enough after copying the files to disk before unmounting the card. Even on a windows box. Have a break, drink some coffee (do not spill it on the Z), have dinner, play with your kids, tell you're wife/husband/girlfriend/boyfriend/dog/cat/... you love him/her, .... Just give it some time.

Chero.

debian ! debian ! debian !

(with kernel improvement please )

... I'm possibly more or less not definitely rejecting the idea that I undeniably do or do not know whether the SD card shouldn't probably be the culprit... (Ouch! Watch my nose!)

Perhaps we need to undertake some more serious empirical scientific research in the phenomenon of the breakdown of the chemical bonding in the romantic relationship between CF and Debian inside a big dog's tummy...

I bet you went to uni ?

Heres a way out there type question - any chance I can install titchy on an SD card?
So I have pdaXii13 running fine on my MD. I would like to try out this titchy thing.....
Got a 2GB SD - say I partition it as 2 x 1GB and stick installer etc on 1 partition and then install to the other? Then when done could use partition1 as /home etc.....
Flaws? Not sure if there is a point in the boot/install where the target hard dirve is sleected/chosen - is there one?

TIA