OESF Portables Forum
Everything Else => Zaurus Distro Support and Discussion => Distros, Development, and Model Specific Forums => Archived Forums => Sharp ROMs => Topic started by: schadfield on April 04, 2005, 04:58:09 pm
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Just tried this on an SL-5500.
1. Looks gorgeous.
2. No IRDA (known issue) fixed soon I hope?
3. Does not sync with Qtopia Desktop 1.7.0 because of version compatibility.
4. Cannot generate British pound sign using Fn Shift-4.
Hope they fix these issues because I would love to have a stable OS that syncs with Linux.
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can't you fix irda by loading kernel modules?
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Can you get your Zaurus to suspend? Maybe I have a bad flash or something strange is going on but mine wont suspend.
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I plan to try it on my 6k in a few minutes. from what i see on the forums re things 2.1 isn't doing, i kinda suspect the kernel should be swapped out. i'll give that a shot too.
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any screenshots?
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Initial impression - good - looks very neat and tidy - and I like the bobbing icon when an app is started (instead of the flash in the older versions).
Cant suspend the thing.
I like the 'cancel suspend when online' power management feature. Thats required.
The apps are the same - thje documents tab is the old version again - I think the one we had on the latest Sharp ROM was and is much better.
The notes app doesnt have the feature of the Note taking app on the Sharp rom - text files as well as notes integrated together.
Got to ry the apps individually now...
Oh yes, the full screen handwriting is nice - but the pencil seems so think - couldnt it be a thinner line (maybe its configurable ?)
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There's a 32mb ramdisk mounted on /mnt/ram
Oh, I got opera to install from the zug feed,
Had to edit /etc/ipkg.conf by hand and add the feed, I also had to modify the destinations as they had /mnt/dest for the destination name instead of just dest
ipkg-link worked as expected and when I restarted qpe I had opera in my tab
I linked opera in /usr/share and its working fine (7.30)
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There appear to be some additional packages at http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP/ (http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP/)
The feed doesnt work that they have in the Software app and I cant make the above url work as a feed, it complains about:
Downloading http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP//(null) (http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP//(null))
sh: Syntax error: "(" unexpected
ipkg_download: ERROR: Command failed with return value 2: `wget --passive-ftp -q -P /tmp/ipkg-m4S69y http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP//(null)' (http://qtopia.net/packages/SHARP//(null)')
Failed to download screenshotapplet. Perhaps you need to run 'ipkg update'?
Not sure what that's all about.
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Been waiting for this too!
I'm really keen to try out 2.1.1, but the "no internal WiFi" bug on the 6000 is too big for me to overlook. I just can't have a Z that doesn't connect wirelessly. When this is sorted out I'll flash over right away.
adf's kernel tweaks sound cool as well.
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Can you get your Zaurus to suspend? Maybe I have a bad flash or something strange is going on but mine wont suspend.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73518\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Is this due to the 'cancel suspend when online' setting mentioned by nilch?
I haven't got time now to reflash and find out.
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Initial impression - good - looks very neat and tidy - and I like the bobbing icon when an app is started (instead of the flash in the older versions).
Cant suspend the thing.
I like the 'cancel suspend when online' power management feature. Thats required.
The apps are the same - thje documents tab is the old version again - I think the one we had on the latest Sharp ROM was and is much better.
The notes app doesnt have the feature of the Note taking app on the Sharp rom - text files as well as notes integrated together.
Sharp made some customizations.
Got to ry the apps individually now...
Oh yes, the full screen handwriting is nice - but the pencil seems so think - couldnt it be a thinner line (maybe its configurable ?)
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73550\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
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3. Does not sync with Qtopia Desktop 1.7.0 because of version compatibility.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73511\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Updated versions of the Qtopia Desktop have appeared on ftp.trolltech.com.
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I downloaded the new Qtopia Desktop on my Mac and it's Great!
I dont see the UI problems that 1.7 had and I was able to sync with the new rom once I adjusted the security settings.
How I wish there was a 64/0 image with home on SD right now!
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I downloaded the new Qtopia Desktop on my Mac and it's Great!
I dont see the UI problems that 1.7 had and I was able to sync with the new rom once I adjusted the security settings.
How I wish there was a 64/0 image with home on SD right now!
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73627\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Have you had any luck getting the Z to suspend with this ROM?
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No, I can not suspend
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Well there are definitely some kinks in this as well as some nice features...
1) The booting time seems to be quick (like that Trolltech logo too) - under 30secs on my 5000D
2) The System info has an additional Tab called "Data" which graphically shows how much of the total data area is broken up by Audio, Images, Mail, text, Video and free
3) There is a Today screen (I guess thats an OZ feature)
(so question here - are the PIM apps DTM based ?) - That would be a DTM based Today app.
4) The Calculator is much better than the original- has Conversion, Scientific etc
5) The new Image viewer has a Slideshow feature
(the bad feature is that it looks all over for all images - and not CF/SD/Internal/folder wise)
6) Oh, Trolltech embossed their logo on the clock too
But the clock has a Stopwatch and a Alarm clock built in (again an OZ feature ?)
7) The Plugin manager is nice - you can configure each little thing to be off or on kind off - got to use it more to appreciate its real value.
8) In Power management - the Disable suspend when online is a good thing - but damm - where is the normal suspend ?
9) As a seperate point - where is the suspend button ???
10) The new Launcher is a good way of setting how to show icons - large or small for each tab seperately
11) The button settings (application launcher buttons) have a setting for Tap and one for hold - nifty
12) Coudnt really make out what the "Application services" is about
13) Full screen Handwriting is nice, but my handwriting comes out as scribbles - no character reconised as such
14) The Software packages is re-designed - but I couldnt get the KDEPIM apps to install at all, or even the older Text Editor - thats all I tried.
and lastly - where is the Suspend thingie ? I am having to switch it off from the back battery switch.
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Well there are definitely some kinks in this as well as some nice features...
1) The booting time seems to be quick (like that Trolltech logo too) - under 30secs on my 5000D
2) The System info has an additional Tab called "Data" which graphically shows how much of the total data area is broken up by Audio, Images, Mail, text, Video and free
3) There is a Today screen (I guess thats an OZ feature)
(so question here - are the PIM apps DTM based ?) - That would be a DTM based Today app.
not an 'Oz' feature. This is Qtopia 2.1.1
4) The Calculator is much better than the original- has Conversion, Scientific etc
5) The new Image viewer has a Slideshow feature
(the bad feature is that it looks all over for all images - and not CF/SD/Internal/folder wise)
6) Oh, Trolltech embossed their logo on the clock too
But the clock has a Stopwatch and a Alarm clock built in (again an OZ feature ?)
nope. Qtopia! Remember, Opie is based on Qtopia and we have grabbed features and such from it.
7) The Plugin manager is nice - you can configure each little thing to be off or on kind off - got to use it more to appreciate its real value.
8) In Power management - the Disable suspend when online is a good thing - but damm - where is the normal suspend ?
9) As a seperate point - where is the suspend button ???
Cancel button held is standard way for Zaurus to suspend. It also suspends on it's own.
10) The new Launcher is a good way of setting how to show icons - large or small for each tab seperately
11) The button settings (application launcher buttons) have a setting for Tap and one for hold - nifty
12) Coudnt really make out what the "Application services" is about
13) Full screen Handwriting is nice, but my handwriting comes out as scribbles - no character reconised as such
Read the help file. You can 'train' it Settings->Handwriting
14) The Software packages is re-designed - but I couldnt get the KDEPIM apps to install at all, or even the older Text Editor - thats all I tried.
Qtopia uses the old style ipkg format. It probably doesn't understand the newer style that Opie uses.
Any error messages?
and lastly - where is the Suspend thingie ? I am having to switch it off from the back battery switch.
Cancel button! or let is suspend on it own.
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Cancel button held is standard way for Zaurus to suspend. It also suspends on it's own.
I'm unable to make my 5500 suspend with the Cancel button with the rom from qtopia.net.
I've not left it sitting for any great period of time however, I'll test when I get home to see if it'll auto-suspend on battery power.
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and lastly - where is the Suspend thingie ? I am having to switch it off from the back battery switch.
Cancel button! or let is suspend on it own.
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This is broken on the 5500 ROM. I found that if I left mine to its own devices on battery far from suspending it would in fact keep turning the backlight on to full power every few minutes.
It is not usable in this state.
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Looks nice, i DO like the bouncing icons
Just a few things...
1) Why is this thread in the Sharp ROM section when the ROM is based on OZ ?
2) Icons lose their titles when you rotate 90 degrees.
3) Suspend does NOT work by pressing Cancel button.
4) Too many icons under a couple of tabs (for my liking)
5) Help icon under Applications instead of Settings ?
thats about all i noticed in the 2 minutes before i reflashed back to my preferred ROM
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from a 6000 (and personal) perspective:
1). Lpotter's advancedfm in opie rocks. it should be here.
2). use a diiferent kernel source. the unified kernel stuff at externe.net seems like it would be a better bet--I think you'd have less hardware problems. (this is speculation--I am guessing that you used the OZ 3.3.6 kernel--nice for demo purposes I guess..but.... well the problems are pretty eveident.) Of course, there could be something else entirely causing the probs that wouldn't wouldn't be solved this way.
3) It seemed a little slow.. but that could be just an impression.
4) I liked the qtopia logo on boot, and the autoreboot after flashing. I wonder though, whay when I flashed from my modified sharp stuff the thing didn't format cleanly?
The old OZ base really surprised me.
It is appreciated. I am curious to see how it ends up looking when "cackoized"
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The old OZ base really surprised me.
The old OZ base is significantly newer than the pre-historic Sharp base though (actually, I'm just assuming this - and I shouldn't - but I don't imagine that the 6000 source has changed significantly).
Or were you wondering why it wasn't buit with a newer OZ base (in which case it's probably that they used what was the current version when they started work and didn't want to mess about and update it part way through).
use a diiferent kernel source. the unified kernel stuff at externe.net seems like it would be a better bet--I think you'd have less hardware problems. (this is speculation--I am guessing that you used the OZ 3.3.6 kernel--nice for demo purposes I guess..but.... well the problems are pretty eveident.) Of course, there could be something else entirely causing the probs that wouldn't wouldn't be solved this way.
Indeed - do you have any reason to suspect this?
Si
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Flashed 2.1.1 last night work great so far.
I have install Qtopia Desktop, but what USB drivers do i have to use ?
OZ version one ?
I have the good old USB Drivers c700 i was using for cacko, but USB device is not reconized atm.
I try to hunt down a good one.
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Actually i just noticed, when i boot my zaurus, my PC detected a C700, etc but when i suspend my zaurus and unsuspend. my PC detected a unknown device. So basically thats mean i ahve to reboo tmy zaurus everytime i want to sync I guess its a beta bug
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If it's based on 3.3.6pre1, then have a look for my start_net.sh script (PXA version for you) to restart net-over-usb - this was a known issue with this version of OZ.
Si
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The reason I suspect it is based on 3.3.6 is that it says it is oz based and sharp compatible. It might be 3.2. It isn't so much that i object to using an older OZ for a base--given the desire for backwards compatibility. It is that in some way the desire for compatibility(shown by use of sharp compatible oz) has precluded compatibility(because that oz is older than the 6k and i am guessing is missing some hardware support)
I am taking it as demo and nothing more. I do wonder, though, how likely it is that anyone is going to make a working 6k setup based on an outdated, unsupported OZ, the point being that it seems that this particular arrangement will end up going nowhere on the zaurus 6000 platform. Presumably 2.1 will be pulled into cacko in the near future and maybe we will see qt 2.1 stuff in other roms built from the ground up, rather than on what was released here.
as to it being based on a newer OZ..why bother.. opie is easily as good, if not better, from what little I have seen.
I guess my take on the old OZ/ current sharp issue is simply about function rather than currentness. I would rather ride a healthy horse than try to drive a wheel-less car, regardless of which is the newer technology. If support of new technology becomes the issue in some way, then it is current OZ that is of interest. either way, from the 6k perspective, it is an odd arrangement.
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I'd guess that they started work on it, using what was then the newest and best (IMHO) base ROM available, and this was all before the sl6000 was available.
Then, rather than change the entire base, they decided to merge in support for the sl6000 after its code was available.
In any case, I imagine that something useful for the 6000 will come out in the fullness of time - either, as you say based, on the 6000 code which Sharp released, or on OZ 3.5.3 (which I think supports the 6000).
Si
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Disclaimer: I don't know more than you do, I'm just making educated guesses and stating personal opinions.
TT is in a dilemma with this ROM. They couldn't base it on anything newer than OpenZaurus 3.3.5 because that was the last release I did and then we abandoned the OZ buildroot. The OpenEmbedded buildroot was from the start tailored for modern base libraries and modern compilers. Up to date, no one of the core team was interested to do any work to include support for gcc 2.95.3 to OpenEmbedded - and since the ROM creator didn't/couldn't want to do this as well this is the reason why OE couldn't and can't be used for so called "compatible" ROMs.
This also means that TT can't easily add support for more machines, especially not the 6000, because OpenZaurus 3.3.5 didn't support it. This not only is a problem for the base machine support but also for the GUI, which you can evidently see when looking at the DocTab. TT doesn't have the source code from Sharp, so they would have to reinvent all the clever things Sharp did to Qtopia 1.5 (which is ironically the same situation we have with Opie).
I don't see much of a point in such a ROM. It's compatible to the 3rd party apps, yes, fine - but that's about it. IMO it would be much more wise to add Qtopia to OE or to add some of the Qtopia apps to OE or to Opie. This ROM just adds up to the fragmentation.
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If it's based on 3.3.6pre1, then have a look for my start_net.sh script (PXA version for you) to restart net-over-usb - this was a known issue with this version of OZ.
Si
[div align=\"right\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=73855\")
For those who like me are looking for the script
This is the script
[a href=\"https://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=9765&hl=start_net\.sh]https://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showt...rt_net\.sh[/url]
And the ipk:
https://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showt...rt_net\.sh (https://www.oesf.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=7038&hl=start_net\.sh)
It seem i still have a problem with my USB, i cant ping on each machine. So I tried on my zaurus
when i do a
ping 192.168.129.1 my machine freeze (then i have to reset it), there was any bug OZ related about USB bug that was not working correctly on a c700 or something ?
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I don't see much of a point in such a ROM. It's compatible to the 3rd party apps, yes, fine - but that's about it. IMO it would be much more wise to add Qtopia to OE or to add some of the Qtopia apps to OE or to Opie. This ROM just adds up to the fragmentation.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=73962\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
That's the impression I had, but thanks for the technical background, it's very informative
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Disclaimer: I don't know more than you do, I'm just making educated guesses and stating personal opinions.
TT is in a dilemma with this ROM. They couldn't base it on anything newer than OpenZaurus 3.3.5 because that was the last release I did and then we abandoned the OZ buildroot. The OpenEmbedded buildroot was from the start tailored for modern base libraries and modern compilers. Up to date, no one of the core team was interested to do any work to include support for gcc 2.95.3 to OpenEmbedded - and since the ROM creator didn't/couldn't want to do this as well this is the reason why OE couldn't and can't be used for so called "compatible" ROMs.
This also means that TT can't easily add support for more machines, especially not the 6000, because OpenZaurus 3.3.5 didn't support it. This not only is a problem for the base machine support but also for the GUI, which you can evidently see when looking at the DocTab. TT doesn't have the source code from Sharp, so they would have to reinvent all the clever things Sharp did to Qtopia 1.5 (which is ironically the same situation we have with Opie).
I don't see much of a point in such a ROM. It's compatible to the 3rd party apps, yes, fine - but that's about it. IMO it would be much more wise to add Qtopia to OE or to add some of the Qtopia apps to OE or to Opie. This ROM just adds up to the fragmentation.
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oe/bitbake is not the Holy Grail to Embedded devices that you think it is. It is silly to have to use oe/bitbake for simple application development, where one cross compiler and qtopia sdk can do. Oe/bitbake uses _way_ too much memory, and is way too slow.
As far as fragmentation, OZ does more fragmentation than anybody - oz using softfloat caused more fragmentation than anything, and talk of opie getting rid of it's qtopia base also fragments things, especially with devices that actually ship with linux/Qtopia. So just think about whos causing fragmentation...
TT is not in any dilemma. You have a lot of wrong suppositions of why Trolltech did this, and the reason why we did this. Buildroot works, and it is stable, and doesn't have crap I won't ever use, and doesn't use a gig of RAM!
If you don't like this rom, don't use it. No one is forcing you. It is for individuals who like Qtopia, or want to demo Qtopia 2.1.1 and want to actually be able to sync their data easily.
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no way to delete posts
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Well..it is for individuals who don't use 6000's anyway. I haven't heard from 3k/1k crowd in here. Does it work for them?
I don't mean to make too much of an issue of this... I've been reading potter and mickey squabble over the advantages of various systems for a while now.
the basic argument has always seemed to me that
OE (mickey) is in favor of using recent software develpment applied to a large platform base, (and that the obvious intricacy of such a thing has made OE complex and OZ, as yet imperfect--as indicate by the clearly marked unstable status of the releases)
(TT)lpotter has argued in favor of slower development and better retention of backward comatibiluity through use and mainenance of the existing software base..a kind of "it works don't mess with it (too much)" approach.
OE has put out some really terrific packages (potters fm ironically is a good example), but had stability and compatibilyt-w/exisitng software issues
SharpRom has been stable with a large base, but not kept up w/ linux development at large in many respect.
The strange thing here is that the TT argument re stability is belied by this ROM. It doesn't support hardware supported by Sharp--making it definitely a contender for the "unstable fork" label." and... if it was going to be unstable/imperfect anyway, it seems to me it might as well have been more up-to-date and been built on OE. If it was intended to be stable, it should have been built on something that actually worked on the hardware.--like a sharp (or tetsu kernel)
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any 7x0 version? the c700 one doesnt seem to work on my 860...
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If you don't like this rom, don't use it. No one is forcing you. It is for individuals who like Qtopia, or want to demo Qtopia 2.1.1 and want to actually be able to sync their data easily.
Why do I feel that normal users are always the last people developers think about when arguing about this
I'm not blaiming you (or TT, for that matter) in particular, it's just that going about things this way users will never get something that's feature-complete and reasonably bug-free.
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Well..it is for individuals who don't use 6000's anyway. I haven't heard from 3k/1k crowd in here. Does it work for them?
This rom does not support the newer Sharp devices.
I don't mean to make too much of an issue of this... I've been reading potter and mickey squabble over the advantages of various systems for a while now.
the basic argument has always seemed to me that
OE (mickey) is in favor of using recent software develpment applied to a large platform base, (and that the obvious intricacy of such a thing has made OE complex and OZ, as yet imperfect--as indicate by the clearly marked unstable status of the releases)
(TT)lpotter has argued in favor of slower development and better retention of backward comatibiluity through use and mainenance of the existing software base..a kind of "it works don't mess with it (too much)" approach.
OE has put out some really terrific packages (potters fm ironically is a good example), but had stability and compatibilyt-w/exisitng software issues
SharpRom has been stable with a large base, but not kept up w/ linux development at large in many respect.
The strange thing here is that the TT argument re stability is belied by this ROM. It doesn't support hardware supported by Sharp--making it definitely a contender for the "unstable fork" label." and... if it was going to be unstable/imperfect anyway, it seems to me it might as well have been more up-to-date and been built on OE. If it was intended to be stable, it should have been built on something that actually worked on the hardware.--like a sharp (or tetsu kernel)
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Works fine for me. If you are talking about the 6000's wifi not working, I don't have a lot of time to devote to this. Patches/fixes welcomed
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I am glad for anyone who is happy with this or any other setup they are using.
I understand that I am perfectly free to make patch or modify any opensource package i want. In fact the first thing i did with this was try to do a quick replacement of the kernel.
That you are suggesting i patch an old OZ to support a new device is not suggestive of that old " it is important that users have a system that works" position you take when discussing options other than Qtopia. In fact the harried "I don't have time" bit sounds like someone from OE talking about backwards sharp, or old gcc support. Very funny.
Let's imagine I had the skill to fix this, though. ( I am not a programer, and don't have the skill) how would i go about it?
would i :
a): rewrite an old buildroot that was abandoned that uses a 2.4 kernel and gcc 2.9?
. compile for a known good 2.4 kernel gcc 2.9 setup?
c). add it to a modern, supported, but awfully complicated build system (maybe 2.6) gcc 3.4?
Not A.
If I wanted solid backwards compatibility, Not A or B
If I wanted better floating point performance and current library support Not A or C.
I feel like i am being drawn into a rather confrontational position here. The thing is, that wasn't where i set out to go. I set out to point out that the rom was interesting but unuseable, and to look into why it seemd to be unuseable. The answer was very weird: Old OZ system on new hardware is not a good solution for the sufficient reason that the hardware doesn't work. never mind the very bleak future of such an arrangement. It seemed to me that a different solution would be better, if it it...worked.
When asked why a new linux handheld should use Qtopia potter immediately replies--because it works. Fair enough. But when something Qtopian does not work, that has to be admitted too. And "it works for me- if you don't like it fix it yourself" isn't really reasonable, nor is it fair play.
I gather there is indeed no interest in making anything but a demo here. OK. I won't try to use a demo as my UI. Nice demo. I appreciate the feature showcase. Anyone planning to pull this stuff into a ROM?
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I am glad for anyone who is happy with this or any other setup they are using.
I understand that I am perfectly free to make patch or modify any opensource package i want. In fact the first thing i did with this was try to do a quick replacement of the kernel.
That you are suggesting i patch an old OZ to support a new device is not suggestive of that old " it is important that users have a system that works" position you take when discussing options other than Qtopia. In fact the harried "I don't have time" bit sounds like someone from OE talking about backwards sharp, or old gcc support. Very funny.
Let's imagine I had the skill to fix this, though. ( I am not a programer, and don't have the skill) how would i go about it?
would i :
a): rewrite an old buildroot that was abandoned that uses a 2.4 kernel and gcc 2.9?
. compile for a known good 2.4 kernel gcc 2.9 setup?
c). add it to a modern, supported, but awfully complicated build system (maybe 2.6) gcc 3.4?
Not A.
If I wanted solid backwards compatibility, Not A or B
If I wanted better floating point performance and current library support Not A or C.
I feel like i am being drawn into a rather confrontational position here. The thing is, that wasn't where i set out to go. I set out to point out that the rom was interesting but unuseable, and to look into why it seemd to be unuseable. The answer was very weird: Old OZ system on new hardware is not a good solution for the sufficient reason that the hardware doesn't work. never mind the very bleak future of such an arrangement. It seemed to me that a different solution would be better, if it it...worked.
When asked why a new linux handheld should use Qtopia potter immediately replies--because it works. Fair enough. But when something Qtopian does not work, that has to be admitted too. And "it works for me- if you don't like it fix it yourself" isn't really reasonable, nor is it fair play.
I gather there is indeed no interest in making anything but a demo here. OK. I won't try to use a demo as my UI. Nice demo. I appreciate the feature showcase. Anyone planning to pull this stuff into a ROM?
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I do not have all Sharp devices here for testing, thus.. only some Sharp devices are usable. If you would like to help me out, and be a beta/beta tester, I do have roms for other devices - c760,c860, but I will not release anything that is completely not tested.
As for the addage that buildroot is old and abandoned, and that kernel 2.4 and gcc 2.95 are too old for being used because they are old, is just silly.
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argh. No, it isn't that I am contending that 2.95 and 2.4 are too old... it is that the old OZ buildroot is too....weird--and the result seems like the worst of both worlds.
I'd be happy to you make this work... though I am pretty unskilled and only have a 6k.
What it looks like to me is that the issue is the kernel/modules, NOT QT 2.1.
Would it be feasable to use a different set of kernel sources?
guylhem has a tetsu-based "unified kernel source (pxa)" on his site at externe.net/zaurus that supports a number of Z's (not the 5500 though )the kernel itself is pretty up-to-date for its version, and has a really nice set of floating point options. the whole thing seems pretty sharp compatible--I use sharp software, 3rd part software for sharprom and stuff off the cacko 1.22 feed maybe something can be done with this? Incidentally..he is updating the kernel and reorganizing the NAND with an eye to making a 6k rom. Maybe there is a way to get some useful collaboration going? (since I am pretty much the weak link here?)
I use a monolithic version of that kernel most of the time.
When I ftried 2.1, I eventually tried to use an updater to flash my version of the kernel into the z. the flash went well, but the gui didn't load. ( I tried this same thing on gpe OZ3.5.2 to see what would happen. went great worked, but no touchscreen---this had also happened on earlier versions of zvncserver) If that helps. is there a patch to the kernel you are using that is missing in the one I am using? is there just something qtopia looks for that wasn't there? I can certainly set up a small server to work on this...
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I can help test on the 860, whenever the bickering stops.
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Ok. this thing has hostap. good if it can be made to work.
the usb modules have to me installed manually. the p80211b isn't there. I used one of mine. it seems to load ok.
So manuall starting usb core usb_ohci... and p80211b seems to work. what else should be staerted to fire up the wireless? and does anyone remember how to work hostap if it is anything other than ifup wlan0?
somebody with a 6k w/ working wireless?
reboots real fast
i
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The strange thing here is that the TT argument re stability is belied by this ROM. It doesn't support hardware supported by Sharp--making it definitely a contender for the "unstable fork" label." and... if it was going to be unstable/imperfect anyway, it seems to me it might as well have been more up-to-date and been built on OE. If it was intended to be stable, it should have been built on something that actually worked on the hardware.--like a sharp (or tetsu kernel)
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Sharp and Trolltech are two different entities - and ironic though it may sound - that the Sharp devices use Trolltech Qtopia (the older versions), but Trolltech will not be able to replicate the same type of ROM's for all Sharp devices since a lot of Sharp's modifications have not been released outside of Sharp. Actually without any other consideration, Sharp has really done some good work in modfying the base system and building over that to make major enhancements.
Be it TT or the OZ gorup, everybody have to create the wheel from scratch (I am talking about the enhancements only) again by themselves since Sharp will not help evidently.
So really TT's ROM (they are not basically in the ROM business) unstability is not becuase they are 'forking' the Qtopia build (as some others are), but because they dont have the source to 'propraitary' enhancements made by Sharp. Lets not confuse Sharp with TT here.
Now having said that as a matter of fairness, I think if TT really wants to bring out ROM's for the new Qtopia - they had better do it in earnest or not at all. I am prepared to give them time and I beleive they will be able to bring out a stable ROM if they seriously want it ... but again what is they interest in bringing out a ROM - apart from building the Sharp compatible ROM community further ? Its not like Sharp - who had a Zaurus to sell.
I wouldn't venture into the argument of which buildroot sucks and which is better - since I am neither knowledgeable nor skilled in those aspects -
but I agree with what adf says
I gather there is indeed no interest in making anything but a demo here. OK. I won't try to use a demo as my UI. Nice demo. I appreciate the feature showcase. Anyone planning to pull this stuff into a ROM?
So be it the community, or TT (or even Sharp - in my wildest dreams ) who delivers this - with a degree of backward compatibility to the large existing base (yes I am all for it) - I say go for it.
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Quick question, since my USB seem to be a problem on my c700, does the 6k rom usb / sync work fine ?
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dunno. I have been trying to get the wireless to turn on.
It locks up coming out of suspend though.... sigh. These are suspiciously ozish bugs... initial 3.5.2 did weird wireless stuff and had suspend issues.
i can't help but think it is the kernel.
How do you drop out of qtopia in 2.1? I could at least test apm -s..
as to what nilch said.
I actually knew the sharp qtopia issue it had been brought up re video acceleration last winter....
What I was thinking was that on the 5600, 6000, 700, 750.760.860and I think the 1000 and 3000, there are 3rd party kernels with backported enhancements that can replace the sharp kernel and be useable with the rest o the rom. Apparently my notion that the ui is compiled more or less against kernel headers and that it is the kernel that does the communication between the hardware and the rest of the software falls short.
My theory has been that since these very good 3rd party kernels exist (and are of a largely common origin, I think) then the kernel/hardware communication is essentially solved already...and that the only remaining issue was to get the ui components to compile and to communicate with the kernel(s). Thus by using extant "known-good" kernel sources (and the compilers that build them?) we would not be seeing what appear to be hardware support problems. ie suspend resume/wireless on the 6k. Maybe my view on this is naive? the build systems usually don't interest me (oe does because the attempt to become "universal" is pretty amazing) except that i do care whether what is built runs.
If some genius out there found a way to build a killer os on a computerized lego block running LOGO I'd be happy...
So.. the question remains..where are these hardware issues coming from? could a dfferent zImage be THE WAY.. or compiling on a different chain....or sacrificing a pigeon....etc.
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You have a lot of wrong suppositions of why Trolltech did this, and the reason why we did this.
Go ahead and educate us!
Buildroot works, and it is stable, and doesn't have crap I won't ever use, and doesn't use a gig of RAM!
Uhm... it is a major misconception to use the term 'stable' for 'no one does any more work on it'.
Building stuff based on buildroot is a waste of time - it has no future, it suffers from extreme bitrot. I don't know how many hours you put into it, but if it's just about compatiblity and syncing, IMNSHO that time would've been spent more wise to improve syncing on modern OE-based OZ releases.
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I flashed this ROM to my 5000d (I was testing backup/restore which incidently, wasn't working - at least the restore part wasn't)
It really looks great, and has a lot of neat new additions.
I am back to cacko for now though, 1)because it IS a 5000d, and I really need all the memory it has as memory. (If it were a simple matter of pasting in something to the work done on cacko, I'd try it, but that's unlikely) and 2), as others have noted, it doesn't suspend on mine either.
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2), as others have noted, it doesn't suspend on mine either.
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whoops. forgot to upload the new image.
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Uhm... it is a major misconception to use the term 'stable' for 'no one does any more work on it'.
Just because you do not work on it doesn't mean no one is...
Stable:
1. Resistant to change of position or condition; not easily moved or disturbed: a house built on stable ground; a stable platform.
2. Not subject to sudden or extreme change or fluctuation: a stable economy; a stable currency.
3. Maintaining equilibrium; self-restoring: a stable aircraft.
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whoops. forgot to upload the new image.
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Any changelogs ... ? I mean anything new apart from the Suspend function working ?
Oh how I would love this ROM [underline] all finished [underline end] for the new devices.
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does 2.1 zoom on vga screens? i didn't see it....
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2), as others have noted, it doesn't suspend on mine either.
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whoops. forgot to upload the new image.
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Hi LPotter!
Does this mean there's a new image with the suspend working?
I'm sorry if this is a terribly ignorant question, but:
Is it a lot of work to change the rom so it installs to SD? Alas, I've tried (and failed) to get a second partion working and available on my SD card, so playing with the ROM seems to be asking for trouble for me, for now.
Edit:
Hybrid ROM has Qtopia installed as an ipk. Is the source available from 2.1 that I might try some cut+paste - to try and make a Qtopia 2.1 ipk?
I'd like to give it a shot.
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So when are the OZ and QT people planning on shaking hands again?
In the meantime, lpotter, is the 860 ROM ready? I'd be happy to try it out this weekend.
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Does this mean there's a new image with the suspend working?
Yes. I had forgotten to install apm on the 5000d/5500 image.
I'm sorry if this is a terribly ignorant question, but:
Is it a lot of work to change the rom so it installs to SD? Alas, I've tried (and failed) to get a second partion working and available on my SD card, so playing with the ROM seems to be asking for trouble for me, for now.
Edit:
Hybrid ROM has Qtopia installed as an ipk. Is the source available from 2.1 that I might try some cut+paste - to try and make a Qtopia 2.1 ipk?
I'd like to give it a shot.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=75294\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Shouldn't be too difficult. At some point, I will have a download to other kernel memory configs.
Everything on the rom is installed via ipkg. Most of what is on the roms are available in the Qtopia 2.1.1 sources at trolltech.com.
Qtopia is entirely installed to /opt/Qtopia, so you could simply move it where you want and supply a symlink, or change the /etc/init.d/qpe script.
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>Yes. I had forgotten to install apm on the 5000d/5500 image.
Thank You!
>>Edit:
>>Hybrid ROM has Qtopia installed as an ipk. Is the source available from 2.1 >>that I might try some cut+paste - to try and make a Qtopia 2.1 ipk?
>>I'd like to give it a shot.
>Shouldn't be too difficult. At some point, I will have a download to other kernel >memory configs.
>Everything on the rom is installed via ipkg. Most of what is on the roms are >available in the Qtopia 2.1.1 sources at trolltech.com.
>Qtopia is entirely installed to /opt/Qtopia, so you could simply move it where you >want and supply a symlink, or change the /etc/init.d/qpe script.
GREAT, Thank you LPotter. I'm not sure when I'll have a free moment, but I'm definitely going to give this a try! I did find the source files. I tried installing several just "out of the box", but it isn't quite that simple.
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Hey everyone, Cancel works fine now!
LPotter,
The more I play with this ROM, the more I appreciate it. THANK YOU
I like:
- the way the icons bob when activated
- the nice clear hourglass when waiting (like 1.6, but unlike 1.5)
- not to mention how nice and clear and neat everything looks (I notice this particularly as my eyes are having more trouble these days...)
- The fact that you can show details on packages in the package manager (like 1.6)
- The fact that everything is installed by ipk and thus, can easily be uninstalled (by those of us who are not that familiar with unix - for others, it's always easy I gather) if there is something with similar capability that we like better. (again, like 1.6 but unlike 1.5)
- The choice in how icons are displayed in the launcher (like 1.6)
- the plugin manager is nice
- The today view is quite fetching. (though in the world of comprimise, I don't know that I'd give up the extra functions of ko/pi for it. It is pretty enough to make me think about it anyway)
- The video player is nice to have. I haven't tried to play videos much, but have been jealous nevertheless, that kino doesn't work on the 5000d.
- I like the music player having check boxes beside all the titles.
- I like being able to adjust volume (with large buttons) from the player
- I like the built-in style adjustments ( 'cuz I always add that anyway )
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Some things would be nice if different:
- The music player would be so much better with a (large) button for turning off the screen (and have it all turn back on when the cancel button was hit). The older media player had a (small) button for this, and it made playing mp3's in the car SO much better.
- I find the documents tab rather useless as it is. I liked the one in 1.5 a lot better. Is there a way to add categories? If there were, that would change things, as it would then be the means of categorizing mp3s for playlists. (and other documents, but music benefits the most) As is is, "business personal unfiled" just doesn't do much for me, and the tab takes a long time to load (I have large CF cards ). For file browsing itself, your advanced FM and treeview have things covered nicely.
Actually, could there be a way to enable/disable the documents tab regardless? That would be very helpful.
- Umm, whatever happened to that great little "Tab Settings" program in 1.5 that dissappeared in 1.6 (and 2.1 beta)? Could we have that back again? Tab manager works, but to be honest, I really like the origional Tab Settings a lot better.
Are you looking for bugs?
System info just refused to load on my just now (but gave a very nice error message instead of just hanging). Said it was due to application error 11.
I also am getting "critical low memory" messages, which just reinforces the fact that I can't use this without the 0 - 32 configuration. 32 mgs of ram is really skimping, and 15 is really pretty unusable.
The QT logo on the startbutton is too big on my machine. It only shows the bottom right quarter of the Q.
Woops, software packages was just terminated due to app error 11 (trying to install the memory applet which lets me add swap files easily). and then hung. somthing tells me "error 11" is related to lack of memory.
After reboot, I have the memory applet installed, but it apparently fails to activate the swapfile on either SD or CF.
(update, swap file works fine on a reinstall - probrably leftover "stuff" on the SD last time)
Thanks!
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Lpotter still need a clamshell tester?
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Thats remember me, lpotter know it, but if someone wanted to know:
(of course i used a rom he changed but i mention it here)
The USB bug i had on the ping, is kernel related. You have to use another kernel.
The Fn work now but put a <enter> first. So doesnt really work.
Still need to fix the USB detection on unsuspend (the PC doesnt detect the device after a suspend unsuspend).
Except that the rom has been working pretty good. I have small sync problem, but
I never had time to test in the last week and half
Thats for the c700.
I should try to find a "known issues" for the buildroot version ljp used
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Lpotter still need a clamshell tester?
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I would like so much to be a clamshell tester, but it seems that the c3000 is not considered as a clamshell.
When I see the amount of rom for the c3000, I wonder if it is really a Zaurus.
Question : Is the c3000 a Zaurus ? (New poll)
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Lpotter still need a clamshell tester?
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=76034\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
I would like so much to be a clamshell tester, but it seems that the c3000 is not considered as a clamshell.
When I see the amount of rom for the c3000, I wonder if it is really a Zaurus.
Question : Is the c3000 a Zaurus ? (New poll)
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Not too much different for the 6k a few months ago, and the 6 is just starting to gain momentum a year after its release. I think if sharp were more cooperative you'd see stuff faster- but it takes time to develop stuff for an undocumented unsupported platform. I think all the developers have plans for the pxa 270 clamshells
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Does this mean there's a new image with the suspend working?
Yes. I had forgotten to install apm on the 5000d/5500 image.
I'm sorry if this is a terribly ignorant question, but:
Is it a lot of work to change the rom so it installs to SD? Alas, I've tried (and failed) to get a second partion working and available on my SD card, so playing with the ROM seems to be asking for trouble for me, for now.
Edit:
Hybrid ROM has Qtopia installed as an ipk. Is the source available from 2.1 that I might try some cut+paste - to try and make a Qtopia 2.1 ipk?
I'd like to give it a shot.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=75294\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Shouldn't be too difficult. At some point, I will have a download to other kernel memory configs.
Everything on the rom is installed via ipkg. Most of what is on the roms are available in the Qtopia 2.1.1 sources at trolltech.com.
Qtopia is entirely installed to /opt/Qtopia, so you could simply move it where you want and supply a symlink, or change the /etc/init.d/qpe script.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=75482\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
I have a problem installing stock ipk's on the new ROM, every-time, they fail during installation with an error message about the root (/) filesystem. I suspect that something is trying to install to the full / system rather then the amost empty /usr file system. Unfortunately, I don't know what I need to be fixing!
One a different note, great ROM, and the apm fix in the new image for the 5500 is great. Does irda work yet, I'd like to get my ir-keyboard up and running with irk (assuming I can get passed the ipk installation problems)
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Well,
I thought I'd try using this ROM for real - thought maybe by moving files to SD and making links (as LPotter suggested), I could overcome the limited memory of my 5000d even without the better 32-0 kernel.
So I started trying to install my old favorites, like Qtopia AdvancedFM, batteryapplet (the one that lets you create and activate a swap file), etc.
But noting seems to really install. The package manager seems to indicate they install without error, but there is never a desktop link, whether I install to "internal memory" or to SD. I'd use the file browser to check if the files are there, but am rather stuck as I can't install one. (and I'm a linux newbie). I could hunt something down with the terminal, but since I don't know exactly where I want to look, this would take a lot of time going through each directory with ls.
I think the files must really have installed as when I tried installing AdvancedFM to internal memory, I got an "extremely limited memory" message immediately afterwards. That probrably means I'm just missing some symlinks somewhere if I'm understanding things correctly.
LPotter,
If having a newbie trying out the ROM is helpful enough to you to warrent your taking the time to help with silly stuff like this, I'll keep testing. Otherwise, I suppose it may be best for me to wait for the final version with the 32-0 kernel.
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Well,
I thought I'd try using this ROM for real - thought maybe by moving files to SD and making links (as LPotter suggested), I could overcome the limited memory of my 5000d even without the better 32-0 kernel.
So I started trying to install my old favorites, like Qtopia AdvancedFM, batteryapplet (the one that lets you create and activate a swap file), etc.
But noting seems to really install. The package manager seems to indicate they install without error, but there is never a desktop link, whether I install to "internal memory" or to SD. I'd use the file browser to check if the files are there, but am rather stuck as I can't install one. (and I'm a linux newbie). I could hunt something down with the terminal, but since I don't know exactly where I want to look, this would take a lot of time going through each directory with ls.
I think the files must really have installed as when I tried installing AdvancedFM to internal memory, I got an "extremely limited memory" message immediately afterwards. That probrably means I'm just missing some symlinks somewhere if I'm understanding things correctly.
LPotter,
If having a newbie trying out the ROM is helpful enough to you to warrent your taking the time to help with silly stuff like this, I'll keep testing. Otherwise, I suppose it may be best for me to wait for the final version with the 32-0 kernel.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=79366\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
of course. I can check this out, cause I have a few 5000d's...
hmm. doesn't seem to be a whole lot of space left there...
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Just tried Qtopia ROM 2.1.1 beta on my 5500. Unfortunately, after flashing, it would not turn on again. I followed the instruction, even tried flashing it again, still can not turn on.
I don't have a CF card reader, I'll have to find one before I can put any other ROM back. Just wondering if anyone's having similar experience? What should I do now?
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Just tried Qtopia ROM 2.1.1 beta on my 5500. Unfortunately, after flashing, it would not turn on again. I followed the instruction, even tried flashing it again, still can not turn on.
I don't have a CF card reader, I'll have to find one before I can put any other ROM back. Just wondering if anyone's having similar experience? What should I do now?
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Did press the reset button after flashing, and remove the cf before attempting restart?
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I downloaded the new Qtopia Desktop on my Mac and it's Great!
I dont see the UI problems that 1.7 had and I was able to sync with the new rom once I adjusted the security settings.
How I wish there was a 64/0 image with home on SD right now!
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How does one sync to the Mac desktop using this ROM?
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I saw a new Qtopia Desktop for download on the site for OS X, I'd think it would be able to sync over IP with the Zaurus.
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lpotter I've got two requests if there is further work on the 5500 version.
A 64-0 kernel for the 5500 and the newest hostap?
I've got one of those Sandisk ConnectPlus 128mb+WIFI cards that I posted the deal on last week or so and I'd like to see it work under the Qtopia 2.1 rom, Right now I think it only works with OZ 3.5.3
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does anyone know where the ipk's are for the pim? I like the pim but not being able to use a spreadsheet program really limits this rom's use for me.
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2 things
lpotter..any hope of getting an opiesheet compiled for 2.1?
and maybe use xqt and gnumeric ?
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Just tried Qtopia ROM 2.1.1 beta on my 5500. Unfortunately, after flashing, it would not turn on again. I followed the instruction, even tried flashing it again, still can not turn on.Â
I don't have a CF card reader, I'll have to find one before I can put any other ROM back. Just wondering if anyone's having similar experience? What should I do now?
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Did press the reset button after flashing, and remove the cf before attempting restart?
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Did you check the little clips that hold the battery in. If one of them is in the unlock position the z6000 will not start , don't know about 5500
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*bump*
is this new TT rom going anywhere, or was it just a way of trying to stimulate interest in getting away from qtopia1.5.4 (sharp proprietary)?
BTW, which version of qt-e does it use?
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It seemed to work fine all on its own...
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It seemed to work fine all on its own...
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I asked Anton Mas about this, and because Sharp use old libraries for their apps, and an old version of qtopia, it's far from non-trivial to make a Cacko ROM which used latest libraries, if not impossible, which wouldn't break all the Sharp applications.
Maybe a hybrid would be possible... or even using "chroot" to put the Sharp apps into a "cage" to make them work.
Sigh. If only Sharp actually licensed their s/w opensource, things would be so much better.
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I asked Anton Mas about this, and because Sharp use old libraries for their apps, and an old version of qtopia, it's far from non-trivial to make a Cacko ROM which used latest libraries, if not impossible, which wouldn't break all the Sharp applications.
Maybe a hybrid would be possible... or even using "chroot" to put the Sharp apps into a "cage" to make them work.
Sigh. If only Sharp actually licensed their s/w opensource, things would be so much better.
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Qtopia 2.1.1 is compatible with applications for Sharp roms.
If you are talking about the applications that come with the Sharp roms, a 'compat' library could be made to supply those symbols that Sharp has created.
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Qtopia 2.1.1 is compatible with applications for Sharp roms.
If you are talking about the applications that come with the Sharp roms, a 'compat' library could be made to supply those symbols that Sharp has created.
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yup, that would do it I think... a chance to move things forward and yet cherry-pick the best that Sharp (!) have to offer.
Once Anton's and "iamasmith" have gotten to grips with the Cxy00 models, it'd be cool to move things forward, if possible to leapfrog OZ.
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Hi all,
i did not read this thread completely, but:
AFAIK it is no problem to use two major versions of a library simultaneous. So it should be possible, to install Qtopia 2.x libraries and applications onto a Sharp-ROM-driven device without braking the Sharp apps. I don't know, if the same applies to QT/E because of the access to the framebuffer device.
greets
Mag1c
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AFAIK it is no problem to use two major versions of a library simultaneous. So it should be possible, to install Qtopia 2.x libraries and applications onto a Sharp-ROM-driven device without braking the Sharp apps. I don't know, if the same applies to QT/E because of the access to the framebuffer device.
well, I'm going to try qt-e-2.3.10 in parallel with qt-e-2.3.2 on cacko... if I ever get it to build!
I'll post back results one day.
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well, I'm going to try qt-e-2.3.10 in parallel with qt-e-2.3.2 on cacko... if I ever get it to build!
I'll post back results one day.
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Hi, i suppose that won't work The major version numbers should difer. Qtopia 1.6.x (or 1.5.x) AND Qtopia 2.x is ok. Maybe Qtopia 2 works with qt-e-2.3.2 ?
greets
Mag1c
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well, I'm going to try qt-e-2.3.10 in parallel with qt-e-2.3.2 on cacko... if I ever get it to build!
I'll post back results one day.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=86205\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Hi, i suppose that won't work The major version numbers should difer. Qtopia 1.6.x (or 1.5.x) AND Qtopia 2.x is ok. Maybe Qtopia 2 works with qt-e-2.3.2 ?
greets
Mag1c
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Qtopia 2.1.1 is compatible with qtopia 1.5 and 1.7 applications
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well, I'm going to try qt-e-2.3.10 in parallel with qt-e-2.3.2 on cacko... if I ever get it to build!
I'll post back results one day.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=86205\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Hi, i suppose that won't work The major version numbers should difer. Qtopia 1.6.x (or 1.5.x) AND Qtopia 2.x is ok. Maybe Qtopia 2 works with qt-e-2.3.2 ?
greets
Mag1c
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=86281\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
Qtopia 2.1.1 is compatible with qtopia 1.5 and 1.7 applications
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I'd be real interested in seeing this work. I just pulled out my old SL5500 to use again, and found it incapable of syncing with my Outlook 2003, configured for Exchange Server 2003 and using the supplied version of Intellisync. The Sharp-supplied version of Qtopia desktop worked fine syncing with the SL5500, but lacked a way to import or sync with Outlook.
I like the fact that the newer Qtopia Desktop software has Outlook sync built into it...though I haven't seen it work with my configuration, either. I replaced my Qtopia Desktop v1.5 with v1.7, then later v2.1.1, and it didn't work with Outlook or communicating with the SL5500...but I haven't upgraded my SL5500 with Qtopia PDA v2.1.1 yet. It's still running v1.5.4.
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Have there been any exciting developments on TT ROM - especially for SL-C860 users (me!), or 3100 (me, maybe, one day!)