Has mass production started?

[BSTM]

The timeline on the 7 Nov Planet update was notable for being very precise and not overtly featuring much by way of contingency. A link to that update:
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gemini-p...087#/updates/36

The latest update, 19 Dec, has a paragraph updating us on the timeline. In that they say "we remain on track to start production in January 2018". The update is here:
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gemini-p...087#/updates/41

It's an interesting choice of words - they choose not to say that the production was going ahead as they said (in the first week of January), but to give scoop for a slip - or introduce contingency if you like.

While I want them to be on the Nov schedule of making the units starting last Monday and finishing this Sunday I somehow don't believe it. Planet management will also be focused on CES (ends 12 Jan) and my gut feeling says that production will start in the second half of the month, and be 'slow' to get going. Some will be madein Jan but perhaps not all? Of course if a supplier really lets them down then it all slips further. Anyway I'm hoping for delivery in February, but wont loose sleep if its March. More then that and I would be concnerned.

[andrewl]

I'll give an example of a successfully crowdfunded electronic device, on Kickstarter Pebble watch:

Campaign end and funding closed: May 18 2012
Production Planned start: September 2012
Actual Production start: January 2013
Shipping started: January 23 2013
All backers fulfilled: December 2013

This would be considered quite a good timeline, delays for Pebble were quite small compared with other Kickstarter electronics projects. In fact over 80% of Kickstarter projects deliver late.

If there are delays caused by unexpected events such as Spectre then summer or autumn 2018 would not surprise me.

Just don't be talking about Zano or Vega+.

[SimonL]

According to Pocket-Lint Gemini starts shipping in the coming days:

“Already earning the company over $1m on the social funding site, the new Gemini, which has finally become a reality, will start shipping to customers who've already ordered via Indiegogo from this week. New orders will be getting into customers hands in the following weeks the company tells Pocket-lint when we went to see the device ahead of it going on sale.”

https://www.pocket-lint.com/phones/news/143...hose-psion-days

[Varti]

According to Pocket-Lint Gemini starts shipping in the coming days:

“Already earning the company over $1m on the social funding site, the new Gemini, which has finally become a reality, will start shipping to customers who've already ordered via Indiegogo from this week. New orders will be getting into customers hands in the following weeks the company tells Pocket-lint when we went to see the device ahead of it going on sale.”

https://www.pocket-lint.com/phones/news/143...hose-psion-days

Fingers crossed then!

Varti

[ArchiMark]

Production has indeed started and some units done and with Planet at CES now...

This is per the new Indiegogo update #42 today....

 

Mark

[Varti]

Production has indeed started and some units done and with Planet at CES now...

This is per the new Indiegogo update #42 today....

Thanks for the heads up Archi, reading it now!

Varti

[depscribe]

Production has indeed started and some units done and with Planet at CES now...

This is per the new Indiegogo update #42 today....

 

Mark

Looks to be pretty good news: " . . .  We are quickly going to test the production units in key countries Japan, UK, USA, Germany for mobile network testing.  

"First Gemini backer units will be shipping in January.

"We will communicate more on the shipping schedules after the CES show." . . .

[Alius]

Production has indeed started and some units done and with Planet at CES now...

This is per the new Indiegogo update #42 today....

 

Mark

Looks to be pretty good news: " . . .  We are quickly going to test the production units in key countries Japan, UK, USA, Germany for mobile network testing.  

"First Gemini backer units will be shipping in January.

"We will communicate more on the shipping schedules after the CES show." . . .

Very good news indeed!  I do not think it's a coincidence this was update #42 - the answer to life, the universe, and everything  

Off-topic, but dep, i always dreamed of owning a libretto.  I think I made do quite well with my Psions though, all things considered.

[speculatrix]

I'm pretty confident that I will receive a Gemini from the first or second production batch.
Planet seem to be a little conservative about over-promising on this, and also seem to be working hard to achieve the quality that people expect rather than building down to a price. This this assures me that we won't be receiving alpha or beta grade hardware, although the software might only be a near release candidate beta.

I don't think they will  to respin the hardware unless a serious fault is found, the product is too low volume and if there's a minor fault they'll probably just hot wire the PCB instead unless they really have to replan the PCB or something because of timing issues causing stability problems for components with previously unseen tolerance variations.

[andrewl]

I don't think they will  to respin the hardware unless a serious fault is found, the product is too low volume and if there's a minor fault they'll probably just hot wire the PCB instead unless they really have to replan the PCB or something because of timing issues causing stability problems for components with previously unseen tolerance variations.

Watching all the CES videos, Janko is quite candid in his answers to questions but there are still a few gaps to be filled. I've read in the following:

1. Mobile cell network testing is ongoing. This will be to make the phone networks in the various territories comfortable with the device I think.

2. Devices will be shipping with software in late beta state. The adaptation of Android is not 100% complete and will improve with updates. GPU hardware acceleration only partially implemented. Oreo some months away, even if GPU drivers are now available.

3. Device will not ship with dual boot linux, it will be Android only. The Debian will be available as a web download for owners to flash in themselves.

4. Linux OS on Gemini is a rough implementation and a long way behind Android. Of course that won't bother the enthusiasts who will enjoy hacking it around. Janko and Planet would be very happy to accept help from the open source community.

5. Hardware production partner is invested in the project, so Planet have not had to fully commit financially to production tooling. This is good as even $1million is not much money to get this type of project in production. This may apply to the final product or the keyboard maker or both (I believe they are two different manufacturers).  Think about 2500 crowdfunded units, the vast majority of keyboards will be for US and EU territories, but those supported markets where there were maybe 10 or 20 backers, imagine have to make just a few special keyboards for each of those. I would hope there is a bespoking process but would still expect it to be expensive.

6. HDMI output is custom mode. This may allow Planet to control accessory sales like Apple try to, although Janko said that the cable adapter is not expensive.
HDMI out is clone screen, not dual expanded desktop.


I do believe that the product will take off on general sale and may have been held back a bit by IndieGogo and risks perceived with putting money into backing projects - there are enough stories of projects failing or being eternally delayed. The future of Planet making these things and a version 2 will depend on it. Psion sold over a million units.

[speculatrix]

thanks, @andrewl, a good summary of the situation.

[BSTM]

Agree - thanks, @andrewl and good to see info from videos consolidated and thoughtful reflection.

I think its going to be quite close as to if the Gemini is long term viable (ie Gemini2 and Gemini3 updates come along) or stalls at this version. I want it to be a success, of course, but I'm not in the camp of going "rah, rah, rah, this is the only show in town with a good small keyboard and so it will naturally be a success."

A lot will depend on the reviews - I mean proper reviews with benchmarking and battery testing etc. That and day-to-day usability that reviewers find. I think the bulk of sales will be Android and it has to be a success there. I ordered back in March looking for a unit to replace my phone with something more versatile. To have it as well as a phone seems wrong - I may as well have a portable bluetooth keyboard and use that with my exiting phone. Or pack my Thinkpad in my bag as I do now - extra weight but very versatile. Anyway having 2 phone size devices, with 2 screens etc doesn't make sense to me.

I keep banging on about the battery only being half the original specified capacity. It's very much pushed as a device for creatives and it has to last lots of hours. If it can't I don't really want to be carrying around a battery power bank - more cables, another thing to charge etc. Others will be happy to, I know. Incidentally when this came up at the London backers meeting in November, somebody from Planet suggested that you could use Airplane mode to extend life and be able to type more. This is bonkers - suggesting I sit in the middle of London with a mobile device and I'm supposed to cut myself off from all comms to get decent life for the use intended. I was also told there was a division of opinion within Planet about if they needed to sort out a bigger battery option or not. My view is coloured by voting with my feet to get a mobile with a big battery - my Lenovo P2 (which cost £200 incidentally) has a 5100 mAh battery and its so liberating not having to worry about power. Performance isn't top class, but I'll take more battery every-time. Anyway I think the original spec was right and the final spec is a concern - but lets see the reality when its reviewed and we get our own units.

As a phone replacement NFC is an option in low-end devices but not high-end (and I think of Gemini as high-end). Fingerprint security is more or less mandatory on all phones - its so convenient. The lack of the latter is a big concern for usability. Both NFC and Fingerprint were originally spec'd and got dumped along the way.

Pukka reviewers might also be very concerned about the optional camera. I don't have a problem with it being an option but 5MB seems laughably crude compared to where all phones are these days. I don't think it inspires confidence and just makes you reflect even more about what you would be giving up if you replaced your existing phone with the Gemini. To be honest I think it's an option that detracts rather then adds to the marketing proposition.

At the moment I'm just not sure how it will work out as a phone replacement - it might all be a bit too crippled - great keyboard maybe, but two limited in other phone respects. We will see. Finally I say all this as Psion 5 user and loved the device at that time. Remember the earlier ones too - started with a Psion Organiser ][!

[Varti]

@andrewl
Thanks from me, too.

@BSTM
The battery is said to be replaceable, so there's hope Planet or some 3rd party might come up with a larger replacement battery that fits the form factor. Same for the external camera, since it's an add-on; the choice of 5MP might have been dictated by space constraints, which in turn might have been due to the last-minute changes done in the PCB layout. If the inclusion of the camera would have been planned from the start, a higher quality one might have been used instead.

Varti

[andrewl]

@BSTM thank, interesting to read reasons for choosing to back Gemini. I would guess there will be pros and cons that are unique to all of us, Planet have to strike a balance and build in what will be important features for most people, unless we each have a custom device built to our own requirements then few of us will be happy with everything.
For my own requirements I've never considered the Gemini as a phone replacement; even though I have opted for a 4G version I will still be carrying a smartphone. I want a Gemini to write on, and so that I can fill otherwise idle waiting moments with productive activity which will hopefully free up other time for me. Currently, for this purpose, I use a Chromebook which gives about 8 hours use. I typically get through about 30-50% of one charge so I am sure that Gemini's battery will be enough for my needs.
In the past a Psion 5 has served this same purpose for me, the only reason that I stopped using the Psion was its lack of connectivity so as long as the Gemini keyboard is close to the Psion usability standard then I am confident that it will be OK.
The feature of Psion 5 that I will miss is the screen. For words I have less use for colour, but I do need to be able to operate in bright daylight and of course the Psion transflective LCD was superb even in direct sunshine. I fear a backlit LCD won't be anywhere near as effective. I would have been very happy with an e-paper display.

[BSTM]

@BSTM
The battery is said to be replaceable, so there's hope Planet or some 3rd party might come up with a larger replacement battery that fits the form factor. Same for the external camera, since it's an add-on; the choice of 5MP might have been dictated by space constraints, which in turn might have been due to the last-minute changes done in the PCB layout. If the inclusion of the camera would have been planned from the start, a higher quality one might have been used instead.

Varti

Yep - some hope for a bigger battery. But I dont think that will help sell the device to those who will review it properly over the coming weeks or 'average users' comparing specs. Unless Planet actualy say soemthing on the subject. The reason they havnt, I think, is because thickning the underside of the case would destroy the current keyboard tilting geometry.  So it's not easy, but nothing is impossible one would hope.