Author Topic: NFC / Payment Experiences?  (Read 5767 times)

NormMonkey

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NFC / Payment Experiences?
« on: December 12, 2019, 11:49:47 am »
Hi all,
Yesterday I tried using Google Pay but I ran into problems.
Every time I tried, I got an error like, "phone moved away to fast" and "try holding the phone to the terminal for longer".
I was at a shop that was not busy, so I tried several times.  I tried putting the phone to the terminal in different positions, and I always kept it there without moving.  Always got the above error, it never succeeded despite several tries.

I used Google Pay with this same associated card on my previous phone, and it always worked flawlessly.

Would appreciate hearing anyone else's story who has had either good or bad experience using the NFC functionality.

Dickon Hood

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« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2019, 11:59:56 am »
It's the first phone I've owned with the functionality, so I wasn't quite sure what to expect.  Works well, though.

The only problem I've had to date was a carpark, with a NFC on entry (to clock you in) and NFC on exit (to clock you out and take payment).  In was fine, but out wasn't: the man at the end of the help button said it was fairly common with phones as the crypto takes ages -- something I've not seen on other payments, I must admit -- and just to hold it there for longer.  Every other transaction I've attempted has gone through about as quickly as with an NFC card, which makes me happy.

Vistaus

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« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2019, 12:30:59 pm »
Just out of curiosity (because I don't have my Cosmo yet): does NFC payment work with the cover/phone closed?

Dickon Hood

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« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2019, 12:38:18 pm »
No.  At least, it doesn't with the shipped firmware, and I forgot to test the update last night.  I doubt it does, though.

Steve Goodey

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« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2019, 03:05:09 pm »
Excuse me for sticking my nose in, but as to working with cover closed, could having the payment app able to run in background be a fix?

Dickon Hood

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« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2019, 04:54:14 pm »
Stick away...

The Google Pay app doesn't need to be working to make payments -- I have no idea of the mechanism, but it works -- so I suspect that won't make any difference.

NormMonkey

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« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2019, 01:10:25 pm »
For working with cover closed, I think it will not work due to authentication.  Google Pay -- and all the banking apps that offer NFC pay as part of their app like Capital One, Amex, etc. -- want you to be at least unlocked.  They don't want it to be possible for someone to grab your phone and pay for stuff.

It is possible there are some out there that might work with cover closed and phone locked, but I don't know of any.

That means phone is unlocked, and perhaps additional auth required as well.  Some of them want fingerprint, some have their own PIN, etc.


As I have noted earlier I have tried with Google Pay on this phone and it has not yet worked for me -- I keep getting the "phone moved too fast" error.  

However, on previous phones Google Pay worked as long as the phone was unlocked.  Samsung Pay required fingerprint ID (as in, phone unlocked to open the app, and then fingerprint required immediately before tapping).

Your Mileage May Vary

Vistaus

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« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2019, 06:09:33 am »
@NormMonkey Thanks. My bank allows payment with only the screen awake (i.e. I don't need to unlock it, it just needs to show the lock screen so pressing the power button once is enough to make it work). Therefore, I wonder if it'll work with just the cover awake. Will find out soon enough when my Cosmo arrives (still waiting as I chose Dvorak, so I'm at the back of the line)

shinkamui

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« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2019, 10:55:59 pm »
I use it almost daily at several stores.  it has great distance compared to some of my other devices.

Dickon Hood

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« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2019, 07:00:13 am »
I tried it yesterday in Waitrose.  Still needs the thing open to work.

Works well, though.

NormMonkey

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« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2019, 04:16:10 pm »
Quick update,

Had a good GPay experience today.  My earlier experience with the "phone moved to fast" issue might just be an issue with that one merchant's terminal.
Will keep trying at different terminals as opportunities arise.  (mostly I just use my debit card, but if a place is not busy / has no lineup I give the phone a go)

Dickon Hood

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« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2019, 04:35:15 pm »
Never use a debit card if you have an alternative solution: someone who manages to swipe your DC details can empty your bank account, which will cause direct debits and cheques to bounce.  You should get your money back, but possibly after an awful lot of trouble -- I know several ISPs will cancel their service if they're not paid on time, which you can't do if your account is empty.

With a credit card, all they can do is take money up to your credit limit, and you have a month to notice and fix it -- much, much safer.  Google Pay may mitigate the DC issue somewhat; I haven't looked into the implications seriously yet.

NormMonkey

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« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2019, 10:42:02 am »
Quote from: Dickon Hood
Never use a debit card if you have an alternative solution: someone who manages to swipe your DC details can empty your bank account, which will cause direct debits and cheques to bounce.  You should get your money back, but possibly after an awful lot of trouble -- I know several ISPs will cancel their service if they're not paid on time, which you can't do if your account is empty.

With a credit card, all they can do is take money up to your credit limit, and you have a month to notice and fix it -- much, much safer.  Google Pay may mitigate the DC issue somewhat; I haven't looked into the implications seriously yet.

This is good advice.  Your protection may vary according to your bank and locale.  

Here in Ottawa, Canada the vast majority of pay terminals use wireless tap-to-pay or chip readers for debit cards which include per-transaction and per-day spend limits, and banks endorse the extra security by granting enhanced user protection.  You can call your bank and resolve fraud issues right away.  The bad old days of disguised magstripe readers are gone.

The downside to credit cards is they make it easier to fall into the trap of spending money you haven't earned.  It's easy to check your account balance and see funds on one hand without realizing how much your debt has grown on the other.

Diligent users mitigate this by checking their debt balance and paying it off frequently, but credit card companies thrive on the knowledge that most users are not diligent.

Personally I use both, but I also have push alerts set up for all my debit and credit cards.  Any time any transaction happens, it pops up on my phone.

Sorry, bit of a digression from the NFC topic.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 10:45:23 am by NormMonkey »

adfh

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« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2019, 11:54:21 pm »
I find Google Pay works, but you have to position the phone precisely (the NFC antenna is located around the camera/flash area. You also have to keep it in place until you hear the POS pinpad/reader chime.
I flip my phone open, press Esc if it goes to sleep waiting for the pinpad/reader to be ready, and then I'm good to go.
I have noticed some vending machines, like those used by Coca-Cola to be particularly sensitive to antenna placement.

I did have one time where the NFC would not work until I rebooted the phone, but since has worked fine.

Vistaus

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« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2020, 06:03:51 am »
Quote from: Vistaus
Just out of curiosity (because I don't have my Cosmo yet): does NFC payment work with the cover/phone closed?

For those of you are rooted: there's now a Magisk Module called 'NFC Screen Off' which also works for payment on *some* devices (as it's a beta module for now). I too am rooted, but haven't installed the module yet, mainly because Magisk Hide doesn't work for the pay app of my bank, so I cannot use the app and module currently. Again: it's currently a beta module, so it's not guaranteed to work yet, but maybe one of you could give it a try