Author Topic: Internal Cf On C1000 (Read 5789 times)

TsingTao · « **on:** May 07, 2005, 07:00:48 pm »

Second question:

I've been told there are instructions somehwere on this board for the extraction of the C3000's internal hard drive for the purposes fo replacing it with a CF Flash memory card. Can anyone etll me where that page is, or is finding it some kind of initiation I must undergo before I am truly 'one of us' ?

First question:

I am planning to purchase a C1000 in the near future. Is it possible to install a CF flash card where the HDD would be in a C3000 ? And if so, has anyone done this and are there instructions available anywhere online ?

Thanks All!

euroclie · « **Reply #1 on:** May 07, 2005, 07:10:43 pm »

Is this the link you're refering to? The guy did achieve some impressing things with his 3000 (replacing the internal microdrive by a static memory CF, or making the second CF slot (the one normally occupied by the microdrive) available for external CF card use...

So extracting the microdrive on a 3000 might not be very difficult.

But I remember seeing another page (don't have the URL right now) which showed that the 1000 is missing the microdrive (of course) but also all the electronics that handles it (i.e. there is not an empty slot in which you'd just have to insert a CF memory card, the whole area on the motherboard is empty), so you'd have to solder a controler on the motherboard and do other technical stuff to make the slot become a reality. IMHO it's out of reach for most of us!

maxg · « **Reply #2 on:** May 08, 2005, 06:50:05 am »

I've seen an opened C1000 myself and you're right - not only the microdrive is not here, but it lacks all the chips and the internal CF slot is not present. Anyway, the reason I saw it open was of course that his owner wanted to add the slot himsef.

I can tell you - it is not easy. That would need some specific tools and devices to do it. However, you may have noticed that it leaves some empt room in the machine so, here is what we've done - Removed the USB port, put an small USB hub inside the C1k, plus a tiny Bluetooth dongle ship - and replaced the mini-A port with a full female port. Unfortunately - it lacks POWER.
I own a 6k myself, and it could provide 500mA current, i.e I use an unpowered hub with keyboard, mouse and USB key with no problem. You can't do that with the C1k, so we're trying to find a way to power USB from the battery, which is not you may expect, an easy trick plus it's very dangerous for both the human and the machine.

Conclusion - if you want to play the geek with your zaurus, that will NOT be easy, but you can do some good thing (e.g add internal Bluetooth and WiFi). That's so much easier with the 6k - I just added a Bluetooth dongle inside, and with usbctl and hotplug it works just perfectly.

albertr · « **Reply #3 on:** May 08, 2005, 08:33:39 am »

I agree - there're plenty of room inside C1K to add a mini-hub, bluetooth module and mini wifi module. And you are right, the power load might be an issue, so you probably won't be able to drive wi-fi off the usb bus power (bluetooth should be fine).

There're couple of things I would be interested to know - there's another usb port off the same ohci root hub as reported by ohci host driver. I would like to know if data lines for this port is traced on PCB and can be identified?
And the second question - there's a spare serial port as well (which I would actually prefer to use for bluetooth over the usb), but do its lines traced on PCB?
If someone with a scoope and knowledge of electrical engineering can open thier C1K and try to take a look at tracing lines, that would be very helpful.
-albertr

albertr · « **Reply #4 on:** May 08, 2005, 08:44:59 am »

Yeah, one more question - does anyone have a good idea where to draw +5V from inside C1K? I think they removed +5V from CF slot, is there any other parts of C1K using +5V? I'm looking for approx. 400mA (max load).
-albertr

maxg · « **Reply #5 on:** May 08, 2005, 08:53:28 am »

USB controllers always have 2 ports. The second seems to be unused. It's not on the PCB (I didn't see it), but the problem is that I fear it's not powered. I didn't notice the second serial either, but I'm not sure about that (I don't own the C1k myself, so I couldn't check now). However, I think the microdrive slot has actually 5V somewhere, I'll check that if I can (well, I'll need a C1k first...). Good luck !

kahm · « **Reply #6 on:** May 08, 2005, 10:45:56 am »

Quote

I own a 6k myself, and it could provide 500mA current, i.e I use an unpowered hub with keyboard, mouse and USB key with no problem. You can't do that with the C1k, so we're trying to find a way to power USB from the battery, which is not you may expect, an easy trick plus it's very dangerous for both the human and the machine.

Oddly enough, I do use my 3000 with an unpowered hub, keyboard, mouse, and CF reader. It's even an older optical mouse. Given the physical similarities between the 3k and the 1k, I'd be very surprised that I can't do the same on a 1k. (Unfortunately, I didn't test my 1k in that set up before I sent it off, and I haven't gotten a new one to test with yet)

Quote

Conclusion - if you want to play the geek with your zaurus, that will NOT be easy, but you can do some good thing (e.g add internal Bluetooth and WiFi). That's so much easier with the 6k - I just added a Bluetooth dongle inside, and with usbctl and hotplug it works just perfectly.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=78752\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

You wouldn't happen to have a write up about what you did to you 6k, would you? As an imminent 6k owner, I'm very interested.

Mickeyl · « **Reply #7 on:** May 08, 2005, 11:37:10 am »

Quote

Conclusion - if you want to play the geek with your zaurus, that will NOT be easy, but you can do some good thing (e.g add internal Bluetooth and WiFi). That's so much easier with the 6k - I just added a Bluetooth dongle inside, and with usbctl and hotplug it works just perfectly.

Sounds pretty cool, I hope you did a detailed foto story on that, did you? If so, where can I see that?

omega · « **Reply #8 on:** May 09, 2005, 09:10:03 am »

Word of warning - you will not find +5 @400mA free inside your Z. Even if somepart of it runs at 5v these days, there will definitely not be enough spare capacity from the voltage regulator as they would scale the system in the design stage to maximise efficiency...

You could add a simple step regulator to get you 5volts directly from the battery... You could also probably connect the shutdown terminal on the regulator to a 3.3v supply line so the 5v regulator shuts down when the rest of the system does.

albertr · « **Reply #9 on:** May 09, 2005, 10:50:16 am »

I've just checked Hitachi 4Gb microdrive specs, and it looks like it's dual-voltage device (3.3V & 5.0V). Of course, since it would be more power-efficient to run on lower voltage, I would guess that Sharp connected only +3.3V to CF slot and runs it @3.3V mode. Can anyone who has C3K run the following commands to confirm it?

cardctl status 0
cardctl status 1
dump_cis -v

Thanks,
-albertr

albertr · « **Reply #10 on:** May 09, 2005, 11:28:35 am »

omega,

I have to agree with you. It might be impossible to find +5V @400mA inside the C1K/C3K Zaurus.

So basically here's the list (not complete, indeed) of difficulties to overcome with stuffing of Wi-Fi module inside C1K's case:

1. Module should be very small to physically fit in place of CF II microdrive (and connector).
2. Module should be able to work as a USB client. SPI and CF interfaces don't count.
3. Should be able to work @ +3.3V. I think most of them do.
4. Chipset used by the module should have mature linux support. Prism2.5/3? Maybe Atmel? Not sure about others...
5. The second usb host port should be traced and identified on PCB. If it's not possible, then a very small USB hub needs to be implanted as well.

Here's some additonal thoughts:

- We need to switch OTG to USB host mode. Could be done with either a small hardware switch installed on the case, or permanently with getting rid of USBD support and Sharp's USB status monitoring. OHCI host driver might need some minor changer (re: second host port) or maybe would work as is.

- Power efficiency. Of course, very important for Zaurus. The module should be able to draw 400-500mA from +3.3V. And it should run at its own power domain, so we can switch it ON/OFF completely like it's done in 6000 with usbctl. (unfortunately we can't use CF's slot +3.3V line (which we can control thru pcmcia)).

- Power dissipation? (it could get very hot). Antenna placement? (RF could suck)

As far as bluetooth goes, it could be a little bit easier. If we can find traces of a spare serial port, 960Kbaud should be plenty for BT 1.1 (even with its overhead). Also most of CSR-based USB dongles can be switched from USB to serial interface, and they all works from a +3.3V line. Also, power requirements and power management of CSR BlueCore2 chips are quite good, so power draw/dissipation is not a problem.

Any corrections, comments and ideas are welcome!
-albertr

stbrock · « **Reply #11 on:** May 10, 2005, 12:33:40 am »

Quote

I've just checked Hitachi 4Gb microdrive specs, and it looks like it's dual-voltage device (3.3V & 5.0V). Of course, since it would be more power-efficient to run on lower voltage, I would guess that Sharp connected only +3.3V to CF slot and runs it @3.3V mode. Can anyone who has C3K run the following commands to confirm it?

cardctl status 0
cardctl status 1
dump_cis -v
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=78885\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

On my new C1K I get "3.3V 16-bit PC Card" on socket 0 for my Hitachi 4GB microdrive. Nothing on socket 1, and no output from dump_cis. (Connecting the Hitachi on the USB port using a CF/USB adapter draws too much and locks up the Z.)

euroclie · « **Reply #12 on:** May 10, 2005, 01:05:20 am »

Quote

Can anyone who has C3K run the following commands to confirm it?

cardctl status 0
cardctl status 1
dump_cis -v

cardctl status 0 reports "3.3V 16-bit PC Card" on my 3k.
dump_cis -v doesn't report anything...

ryouga · « **Reply #13 on:** May 16, 2005, 07:35:51 pm »

Quote

Word of warning - you will not find +5 @400mA free inside your Z. Even if somepart of it runs at 5v these days, there will definitely not be enough spare capacity from the voltage regulator as they would scale the system in the design stage to maximise efficiency...

You could add a simple step regulator to get you 5volts directly from the battery... You could also probably connect the shutdown terminal on the regulator to a 3.3v supply line so the 5v regulator shuts down when the rest of the system does.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=78867\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

Would it be possible to put a BT module internally in a 3k or is it too cramped in there with the microdrive? If it's reasonably easy to add internal BT to the 1k, I may decide to go with that (of course I should go with the 3k anyway as I'll never get around to opening it up and doing this anyway... )

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Author Topic: Internal Cf On C1000 (Read 5789 times)