Showstoppers 3.5.1 (my opinion)

[otzenpunk]

I wrote in another thread, that there are some annoying things with 3.5.1, that prevent me from using it yet. My configuration is Zaurus SL-5500G, OZ3.5.1 (opie), / directory on SD card, like in
http://www.openembedded.org/oe_wiki/index....ot%20filesystem

1. and most annoying:
I've got a cf memory card (32 MB) and a Micronet CF Ethernet Card (NE2000 compatible). When I boot OZ, everything is fine. I can insert the memory card, use it, and eject it as often as I want. I can insert and use the ethernet card as well, get an ip address from dhcp, and eject the card again. But after I used the ethernet card once, I have problems using it a second time. It won't get an ip address, although the card is recognized and marked UP and RUNNING in ifconfig output. As a workaround, I can insert the card, go to network config, stop the interface, eject the card, insert the card again and start the interface.
Furthermore the memory card won't work again after I used the network card once. It will freeze the screen and keyboard until I reeject the card.
Only known workaround is to reboot my Zaurus.

2.: Opie or OZ does not recognize timezones. This means, if I sync my calendar from my PC (Qtopia Desktop on Linux) every entry happens to be shifted by two hours. IIRC this is a known issue, but not yet fixed.

3.: Suspend will occasionally freeze. I don't know how to repoduce this, sorry, but it happened two me twice (thrice - it just happened again while I was typing and the power saving function kicked in - and now, ten minutes later, again, this time when trying to recover from suspend) in the last few days, that I tried to suspend my Z but it only turned off the light of the display and froze afterwards. The display still showed the opie-desktop but with lights off and I had to do a reboot.
Another time I wanted to recover from suspend but it did not work. Even a reset did not at first. I suspect that the last suspend did not complete so the battery lost power, because when I plugged in the power cable and waited for some time, it worked again.

Additionally, there are some more problems of less importance I experienced:

4. A couple of packages like task-opie-games depend on qpe or qpe-base packages, which are not in the feed. Therefore installation of these packages is not possible. Don't remember any other examples, but there were at least one or two more I think.

5. aqpkg freezes immediately and I have to reboot. opie-packages freezes sometimes, when I want to see details about a package, but otherwise works ok.

6. Additionally it would be very nice to split the OZ3.5.1 feed into a gpe and an opie one (and perhaps a third one called "undecided"). So the package list is not cluttered up with lots of packages that you won't ever need in your environment.

[Hrw]

But after I used the ethernet card once, I have problems using it a second time. It won't get an ip address, although the card is recognized and marked UP and RUNNING in ifconfig output. As a workaround, I can insert the card, go to network config, stop the interface, eject the card, insert the card again and start the interface.

should be fixed now - will be available in 3.5.2

2.: Opie or OZ does not recognize timezones.

Install timezones from "upgrades" feed.

4. A couple of packages like task-opie-games depend on qpe or qpe-base packages, which are not in the feed. Therefore installation of these packages is not possible.

will look at it - but it shouldn't happen.

5. aqpkg freezes immediately and I have to reboot. opie-packages freezes sometimes, when I want to see details about a package, but otherwise works ok.

strange.. maybe you should wait a moment later.. OZ 3.5.1 feed is big so parsing it needs time

6. Additionally it would be very nice to split the OZ3.5.1 feed into a gpe and an opie one

It is planned for 3.5.2

[otzenpunk]

But after I used the ethernet card once, I have problems using it a second time.

should be fixed now - will be available in 3.5.2

That will be fine.

5. aqpkg freezes immediately and I have to reboot. opie-packages freezes sometimes, when I want to see details about a package, but otherwise works ok.

strange.. maybe you should wait a moment later.. OZ 3.5.1 feed is big so parsing it needs time

No, I did wait for quite a long time. But  here somebody had this problem, too. His fix did not fix it for me, though. But I have no problem with using opie-packages for now.

6. Additionally it would be very nice to split the OZ3.5.1 feed into a gpe and an opie one

It is planned for 3.5.2

I'm glad to hear this. Is there already a plan, when 3.5.2 will be ready? When I'll get the networking fix and perhaps the suspend problems will be gone (or less frequently), I will be quite happy with it.

[acpkendo]

I have unfortunately had to go back to the Sharp ROM due to a couple of "deal-breakers."  I call them this because, as far as I can tell, none of them are the fault of the OZ team.  In fact, this is the first release I've been able to really use (the previous ones froze as soon as I inserted them in the cradle, for whatever reason). . . and I am REALLY, REALLY disappointed at having to go back to the stock ROM.  But my issues are:

1) No sync with Outlook- I know it does sync with Opie via Intellisync 1.43, but unfortunately I use notes and e-mail attachments extensively at work, and this older version doesn't support it.

2) No Opera- Konqueror didn't work real well for me.

3) No .doc/.xls compatible apps.  To be honest, I think opie-write and opie-sheet are as good or better than the Hancom apps, but the HTML files that opie-write produces are a pain to convert to other formats, and opie-sheet doesn't let you do so at all.  If these could save in .doc/.xls (or even better, .sxw and .sxc formats, respectively), I'd be real happy.

I would be remiss if I didn't also say what I did like about the ROM.

1) On-the-fly rotation- I didn't think the semi-on-the-fly rotation was so bad until I had this.  It's really great.

2) the feeds- I imagine you there are feeds for the Sharp ROM's too, but not any so extensive, well-maintained, and. . . well. . . Debianesque as OZ's (aahhhhh, Debian. . .)

3) the community- it's nice to actually get responses from folks like hrw, mickyl, and lardman on issues.  I've never actually contacted sharp about a problem, but I've heard bad things.

4) Proper battery/apm functionality- I'm just too lazy to re-flash Sharp's ROM with another kernel.

5) Overall feel- OZ, more than any other ROM (I've tried tkc.rom, YAR, and one Hybrid ROM or another), it just feels more like a full-fledged "operating system," as opposed to the software that the maunfacturer shoehorn's in there so you'll buy their device.

Just my thoughts. . .

[zenyatta]

acpkendo: I have to disagree about opie-sheet. I once looked into it and it's a tragically unmaintained piece of software (and I unfortunately don't have the resources to step up to it). The file format is especially bad. For example, it does not save column widths/row heights, and uses a very crude way of saving cell data to a file, such that each time the Cell class should change its implementation you'd get a new, incompatible file format.

The best way to implement office formats would probably involve the XMerge tool from OpenOffice.org. It lets you save a stripped-down version of an office file (excluded or lower resolution graphics etc.) which you can then edit on a small device. XMerge then automatically integrates changes made in the stripped-down file back into the original file. If this was integrated with a sync tool, so that .doc files transferred to the Z would automatically be shrunk and then XMerged on the way back, it would indeed be very powerful. Besides, office apps on the handheld could concentrate on useful features rather than dealing with all the possible quirks of the file formats.

z.

[alienz]

I have a similar problem with my Wireless NIC. I have to start the Z up without the card in, plug it in, wait for it to find my AP, but then run udhcp manually. Even then it's kind of a crapshoot as to whether it picks up an IP.

Is this the same problem otzenpunk was having?

[acpkendo]

@ zenyatta

I have to disagree about opie-sheet. I once looked into it and it's a tragically unmaintained piece of software (and I unfortunately don't have the resources to step up to it). . . For example, it does not save column widths/row heights, and uses a very crude way of saving cell data to a file, such that each time the Cell class should change its implementation you'd get a new, incompatible file format.

Well, I will say that I'm by no means a power spreadsheet user.  All I ever use Hancom Sheet is for jotting down a few figures, maybe doing an @SUM or so, but not much else.  For the couple tasks I tried with opie-sheet, it worked alright for me.  Insofar as I didn't have to move the file elsewhere, that is. . .

The file format is especially bad.

Agreed.

The best way to implement office formats would probably involve the XMerge tool from OpenOffice.org.

Perhaps- let's put aside for the moment that it only supports Palm, PPC, and Symbian right now.  I'm a bit skeptical about its ability to reconcile changes that might occur between two different versions of a document.  I don't do a lot of spreadsheet, but I DO do a lot of writing.  Suppose I compose a 10 word sentence on the desktop side, and send a version to the Z.  Then I change words 1-4 on the desktop side, and words 5, 6, and 8 on the Z side.  How would you even represent these changes to a user?  Ask them which word to use for every word changed, akin to confirmation in Intellisync?  What if I added a word (i.e. one side is 11 words now)?  I'm afraid I wouldn't trust a program to "intelligently" merge these changes.

I was actually quite excited by XMerge when I still had my Visor, but after reading about how it operated I got very nervous.  I would actually much rather see it operate on a "check-out, check-in" mechanism (i.e. when you go mobile you "check-out" a doc such that it cannot be edited on the desktop side.  Once you get back, you "check it in" again).  For now, and for me, a much better solution is to put the documents on cross-platform media such as an SD card, and edit them directly.  Hence the need for opie-write and opie-sheet to handle other formats.

[zenyatta]

@ acpkendo

The problem of merging different change sets is I think well researched and the present tools work - to an extent (I've recently used sdiff for a few things and was quite impressed). The merging program can always flag conflicting changes and let you decide - perhaps with a little on-the-spot editing. It's always a better solution than crude syncing by timestamp (which would obliterate one of the change sets in the example you have described). I would also argue it's better than having just one copy of the file. But a check-in/check-out system would certainly help, I can see that. And it wouldn't even be too difficult to implement...

[acpkendo]

@ zenyatta

"Well-researched" by whom exactly?  Why, just yesterday, I tried to merge changes from two versions of an Excel spreadsheet, and it completely borked!    

In all seriousness, I hadn't considered that this might have been based on diff and its derivatives. . . which have certainly been used for development for some time.  In the case of a very long document, I still say that I wouldn't trust a program to merge the changes for me.  I will say in retrospect that it probably wouldn't be a big deal to present all the changes to the user, like accepting/declining changes when using "Track Changes" in OOo.  This sort of thing would probably be easier due to the open format (all hail open formats!!!).

[zenyatta]

@ acpkendo

Of course, diff & Co. were designed with short, 80-column lines in mind. In a word processor where you generally have no line breaks within a paragraph, things obviously have to work differently.

Having said that, the only danger I see is the merging program being too smart for its own good and making arbitrary judgements on your behalf. That's a common mistake on the M$ side of things, fortunately it can (and would) be quickly eliminated in an open-source environment (all hail open source  ).