Zaurus As A Laptop/desktop

[soundwave106]

I would've said the same thing about the iPod (too too expensive), but Apple's got style. People tend to be more stylish than us geeks.  

The tiny PCs aren't fast, but that's fine. The Nanode I was looking at for a (way in the future) PVR probably is also going to run at 1Ghz. Here's the kicker, though, the Nano-ITX and Mini-ITX boards have built in hardware for the tough stuff - like MPEG decoding. And 1Ghz = fanless design. This makes it perfect for PVRs, car radios, and other media applications. I'm sure Apple has a similar design where hard stuff like MPEG is hardware.

Apple's the first one bringing the Mini-ITX / Nano-ITX concept with style and flair. Plus, their built in apps are cool. Aside from web browsing and junk like that, that iLife suite means you get a built in music player, 8-track studio recorder (if Apple has a good USB multi-soundcard, this is a killer for us beginning musicians  ), play DVDs, edit HD video, etc. Granted the apps look basic compared to pro stuff but many people don't need more than basic.

No built-in PVR, though. That would've made me consider the Apple too.

[davidmcnaught16]

Very true!  Style is a very important factor, probably more than performance, as long as the performance is acceptable.  

I was looking into making cases for NanoATX mobo's, purely because they could be so cool, and a premium could be charged for that even if it's not blisteringly fast.  

They would be up to 1.4 Ghz (EPIA Ghz are not the same as K7 / P3 Ghz, so it would not be as fast for many things, but as you say, some built in features would make it faster for other things).

Sadly the Epia-N has taken ages to come out, and now the Mini Apple has reduced (But not eliminated) the likelyhood and extent of it's success!

[JohnKiniston]

There are a couple very nice PVR products for OS X, Formac makes one as does ElGato.

We have a Formac DVR at work that we use every day to capture TV to DV streams we can edit in iMovie.

[bluedevils]

forget all that (boy are we off topic)!  Imagine the ease of installing a mini mac in a car glove box or inside a side table drawer in the living room!  It's not meant to be a power machine, but a competent machine.

[kahm]

I want a mac mini just because I want a low cost option for an OSX box.  Buying a used g3 or g4 at less than half that speed for the same price just doesn't wash with me.

A 1.2ghz G4 is NOT a slow computer. And with the Radeon in there it should support the Crystal (or whatever their special graphical extensions are called) which was the main reason that the UI was slow on earlier models. You'd definitely have to upgrade the ram, though. Macs eat ram for lunch, but can get away with lower clock speeds.

The Mini is definitely not a gaming platform, though.

[soundwave106]

Heh... I was hoping not to pay for something.

But Elgato this week updated EyeTV to support Clear QAM, ie, unencrypted digital cable.  That might steer me away from MythTV.  

Yeah, this is off topic, but interesting to me. Especially if Apple with EyeTV can provide a HDTV recording solution before the FCC starts enforcing that broadcast flag on gear.

[Antikx]

This discussion got a bit off track but I'm quoting part of my previous post below.

I still intend on getting a Zaurus this Spring/Summer and would really, really like VGA-out working. I would like to be able to play games and watch movies on a monitor or TV, but I don't know if USB 1.1 is capable of that kind of refresh rate. (can someone with experience update me). I would be happy though with a slower refresh rate that would be accecptable for text editing and surfing.

I have a friend who is a real expert with Linux on PC's and is a very intelligent guy. I think that if he was properly motivated he would be able to write a driver/kernel module or what ever it took to get VGA-out working through a USB device like I've linked to (see below).

I havent' talked to him yet, and he may just do it for free, but if I were to get him to set up a paypal account (if he doesnt' allready have one) would anyone else be interested in donating toward the work that would give us usefull VGA-out? I'm not trying to start a scam. Honestly. I'm just really interested in making my Zaurus my main computer and VGA-out is important to me.

Does anyone have an suggestions for USB video devices that have allready been successfully used under PC Linux? I was thinking that maybe we could take advantage of work someone else has allready done and not reinvent the wheel.

-Antikx

Hey chayimkirshen, I have the same dream you do.

I'm new to ZUG and I currently use a Palm Tugsten C for alot of things but I'm limited by the 320x320 screen and an OS that won't let me hack around as much as Linux. I'm really thinking of moving to a Zaurus (either 6000L or C3000) and taking advantage of the USB host and using a USB mouse and kbd.
But you're right... how to export the video.
I've thought of a few ideas that haven't been mentioned yet.

Any video accessory is limited to the BUS speed limitations of the connector it attaches to. I don't know if the SDIO or CF slot can handle the amount of thoroughfair that streaming video (and sound?) produce but I would think that the USB1.1 port could since it is capable of 10mbps (correct me if I'm wrong). I know hauppauge PCI cards have been suported quite well under linux so I wonder if someone could write a driver for the Zaurus for something like this:
http://www.smalldog.com/product/37703

[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=61434\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

[kahm]

I have a friend who is a real expert with Linux on PC's and is a very intelligent guy. I think that if he was properly motivated he would be able to write a driver/kernel module or what ever it took to get VGA-out working through a USB device like I've linked to (see below).
http://www.smalldog.com/product/37703

Interesting device. It *looks* like a usb1.1 device. I dug up the specs at the hauppague homepage. The only other usb video output devices I've seen are USB2.

Keep in mind that it is an S-Video output, though. It's NTSC or Pal output, which isn't even 640x480. And willingness to write a driver is well and good, but getting documentation to start writing is the hard part.

[adf]

output to a bigger screen would be really a very good thing. really.  even vga out (though a little more would be better) would rock

[ev1l]

I don't know how you ever could push enough bandwidth over USB 1.1 to get a decent VGA refresh rate.

[Antikx]

I have a friend who is a real expert with Linux on PC's and is a very intelligent guy. I think that if he was properly motivated he would be able to write a driver/kernel module or what ever it took to get VGA-out working through a USB device like I've linked to (see below).
http://www.smalldog.com/product/37703

Interesting device. It *looks* like a usb1.1 device. I dug up the specs at the hauppague homepage. The only other usb video output devices I've seen are USB2.

Keep in mind that it is an S-Video output, though. It's NTSC or Pal output, which isn't even 640x480. And willingness to write a driver is well and good, but getting documentation to start writing is the hard part.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=74101\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

It says it can capture at 320x240, but maybe it can output at 640x480. Not sure.

 I know SVideo can do atleast 640x480 as I'm doing 800x600 from my MythTV box to my TV.

[Antikx]

I don't know how you ever could push enough bandwidth over USB 1.1 to get a decent VGA refresh rate.
[div align=\"right\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

Ya. I wonder too.
Here's info about USB 1.1 (or 1.0?):
[a href=\"http://www.usb.org/faq/ans2#q1]http://www.usb.org/faq/ans2#q1[/url]
It says:
Original USB: 12Mbits/s (1.5MBYTES/s)

I wonder if the bottleneck would actually be the USB architecture. It might be some part of the Zaurus between the software and the actuall USB BUS that might slow everything down to a crawl.

Has anyone done any speed tests with copying files to an external USB HDD or fast flash drive?

[kahm]

Interesting device. It *looks* like a usb1.1 device. I dug up the specs at the hauppague homepage. The only other usb video output devices I've seen are USB2.

Keep in mind that it is an S-Video output, though. It's NTSC or Pal output, which isn't even 640x480. And willingness to write a driver is well and good, but getting documentation to start writing is the hard part.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=74101\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

It says it can capture at 320x240, but maybe it can output at 640x480. Not sure.

 I know SVideo can do atleast 640x480 as I'm doing 800x600 from my MythTV box to my TV.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=74128\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]
[/quote]

The unit is quoted at 525 lines for NTSC. You aren't actually getting 640x480, and you're certainly not getting 800x600 - it's is being interpolated down. NTSC encoding is *really* wacky. You've usually got an effect 400x300 at most.

[Antikx]

The unit is quoted at 525 lines for NTSC. You aren't actually getting 640x480, and you're certainly not getting 800x600 - it's is being interpolated down. NTSC encoding is *really* wacky. You've usually got an effect 400x300 at most.
[div align=\"right\"][a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=74130\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][/div]

ahh. that's right. and that explains why 800x600 looks so fuzzy on a normal tv.

Thanks for clarifying that kahm.

I may have to think more about the video camera idea.

[adf]

ugh. the data rate i pretty low.  I forgot I wasn't talking compressed video.... if compressed it would have to be done BEFORE hitting the usb..... no way the z has that kind of power.  "greenscreen" it? that would be nostalgic for a few of us