Keyboards

[Ferret-Simpson]

hey, I'm the opposite of a touch typist usually. I touch correct.

[Da_Blitz]

actually what i proposed was 2 frogpads (2 x 1/2 psion keyboards) that fold up in normal use and can be opened up to a laptop sized keyboard (or full psion)

i have been using dvorak for awhile now (hence the wierd typos) and i am begining to feel that most people wont cahnge because they cant be stuffed, its not hard at all. i did notice the lower impact it seems to have on my hands and i have found that i tend to think dvorak is beter laid out (mabey i just use it a bit too often)

i am intrested in getting a frogpad, they say you can pick up a corded keyboard faster than another keyboard layout as it dosent interfere with your "qwerty" part of the brain and can co exsist, perhaps i should just remap my keyboard to give it a go

actually i think it would be better to butcher an old keyboard i have laying around, althogh i am using a G15 under linux and havent bound the "G" keys yet

oh and overlays are a no-no, i have said it before, we simply dont have the manufacturing capabilities and in my opion it is a PITA

[zmiq2]

just found this provider

http://www.storm-interface.com/dyncat.cfm?catid=19316

lloks nice resistant and cheap.

[adf]

durable and useable.

Backilghting a definite plus.

maybe chording with a foldout.  I don't think (though honestly I haven't tried it) I'd like to be stuck wtih a cording + external kbd only option..  

a backlit z keyboard would certainly suffice.

I suspect that you'll provide useable options.  wouldn't be much point if you didn't.  get what useable reliable stuff that can be easily and reasonably acquired and we'll see what can be done, maybe?

[morrijr]

i have been using dvorak for awhile now (hence the wierd typos) and i am begining to feel that most people wont cahnge because they cant be stuffed, its not hard at all. i did notice the lower impact it seems to have on my hands and i have found that i tend to think dvorak is beter laid out (mabey i just use it a bit too often)

I've considered switching to a dvorak layout several times, however 3 things hold me back...

1) I've a high (touch) typing speed and would have to relearn a lot of 'finger' memory
2) my favourite (and most comfortable) keyboard I've found is a split ergonomic which (if I understand the finger layout for dvorak correctly) would stop my right first finger reaching the 'T' (on a qwerty keyboard) character equivelent.
3) I work in an environment/job where I use other peoples computers a lot - none of which have a physical dvorak keyboard and few, if any, have the dvorak layout installed.

So, while I'd love to switch I don't think it would be feasable.  Please keep a qwerty option available.

J.

[Da_Blitz]

not really what i was looking for, the providers we have already seem like the best as they do custom keyboards

the cording keyboard is really somthing i only expect i will use, if we put the keys on the back of the PCB as the folding keyboard would imply you can relaly have any layout you want

the only problem is if you have a normal Z keyboard when folded up then you cant have a full keyboard when folded out, you can have the normal Z keyboard plus a game pad or touch pad or whatever you want on the second half

basically you get 2 areas about the size of the Z keyboard, when folded up you can only see one half, when oppened you get the original and another half so you can see why a corded keyboard makes sensce if you want a full sized keyboard, its the only way to achive it without what i would call "hacks"

the other reason for having the buttons on the PCB is that the overall hight becames thinner, which is essential in a fold out keyboard as hight is a killer (do you want a PDA thats thicker than a c3000, i dont mind but others wont

[morrijr]

I have to admit, a fold out keyboard isn't high on my personal needs for a pda.  The Z5500 was OK and the clamshell style would be fine (again, personally).

I'd also be concerned with the joint between the two halves and how the keyboard (if it could) operate when folded.

[BarryW]

I have to admit, a fold out keyboard isn't high on my personal needs for a pda.  The Z5500 was OK and the clamshell style would be fine (again, personally).

I'd also be concerned with the joint between the two halves and how the keyboard (if it could) operate when folded.
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That would definitely be a failure point.  I get alot of laptops with broken display cables up here.  Most is because people don't let their laptops warm up after leaving them in the car over night.

[Ferret-Simpson]

Again on the Failure point. It's not worth it. Better to keep the internal one an internal one. After all, if your keyboard snaps in half, you're gonna have to buy a new boardset.

[Da_Blitz]

ferret simpson, i dont fully understand what you mean by internal, if you are reffering to the keyboard then there is no "external" keyboard, the main PCB piviots and folds out

BarryW, dose that include tha cables going to the screen on the Z, at the moment i am looking into using thin flat cable (the yellow see through plastic stuff with the tracks going throgh it) as it has the density and flexibility required for this to work

ferret-simpson we would be using a cable, if it snaps then you will have to buy a new 30c cable to connect the boards. its the same type of cable they use in every mobile phone with a hinge (see above)

its funny that you mention about the cold ruining hardware, i have heard of it but over here in australia things like that dont happen, over here we are more concerned with high temprutures and dust but it does give me somthing to think about

[adf]

ferret simpson, i dont fully understand what you mean by internal, if you are reffering to the keyboard then there is no "external" keyboard, the main PCB piviots and folds out

BarryW, dose that include tha cables going to the screen on the Z, at the moment i am looking into using thin flat cable (the yellow see through plastic stuff with the tracks going throgh it) as it has the density and flexibility required for this to work

ferret-simpson we would be using a cable, if it snaps then you will have to buy a new 30c cable to connect the boards. its the same type of cable they use in every mobile phone with a hinge (see above)

its funny that you mention about the cold ruining hardware, i have heard of it but over here in australia things like that dont happen, over here we are more concerned with high temprutures and dust but it does give me somthing to think about
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I always thought that leaving an lcd in a cold enough envirnment, long enough would kill it.  I had thought North pole (near fairbanks) would be cold enough.  Does it happen there?

[Ferret-Simpson]

Internal. Stuck in. Doesn't do "Out" no out involved. Out is NOT on the menu!

That's internal.

[systemparadox]

I'm very much open to a completely different style of keyboard, but I have a feeling that that's going to be an optional external extra.

Add me to the list for dvorak layouts, though I don't mind if I can just tell the qwerty model to send dvorak keys (I don't need to physically relabel the keys- actually this would probably confuse me- I look at the qwerty keys to type dvorak).

Some requests/ideas...

The keys for the Zaurii (both SL and C series) are spaced too far apart and are too small. Make the keys larger, make them almost touch (like laptop keyboards), and bevel them slightly (so the middle is higher than the edge). Also, the keys are too noisy. However, the organisers I have had previously have had rubber keyboards- these are too soft and have no feedback. What we really want is something like the Nokia 9500. You can feel them, but they don't make a noise.

Backlit would be good, but like the screen, make sure that they can be lit VERY VERY slightly- for use in absolute darkness (like in bed).

PLEASE, PLEASE, make the enter key span two rows.

Thanks
Simon

[Da_Blitz]

good point about the enter

at the moment if you do use the fold in half design and keying layout i am talking about then you would get full sized laptop keys, hence why i sugest it as i really do like the large buttons but larger keys are a definite must

good point about the backlight, i use ncmpc on the command line with a black backgorund and it can still be hard on the eyes

[Da_Blitz]

looks like someone partially stole my idea

http://www.engadget.com/2006/11/07/samsung...s-xp-at-75-mph/